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	<title>Comments on: Yankee Panky: Expert Texpert Choking Smoker &#8230;</title>
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		<title>By: monkeypants</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244229</link>
		<dc:creator>monkeypants</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 20:51:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244229</guid>
		<description>[62] If everyone make the same &quot;inexplicable&quot; decision, then surely it is not &quot;inexplicable&quot;....and this is not a matter of simple semantics.  Your own analysis of the situation betrays your hyperbolic rhetoric.

Look, if we want to have a reasonable discussion about how managers misuse their relievers, I&#039;m all for it.  By now you should know that I agree in general with that premise.

But using over the top rhetoric does not further the discussion, and in fact often clouds it.  What we are really talking about now is not whether Girardi did something that was inexplicable (i.e., unexplainable, incomprehensible, etc.).  Rather we are speaking about the much more mundane: that Girardi does not rise above very predicable tendencies of most MLB managers.

Now that we have dispensed with the hyperbole, we can continue the discussion, and focus on what then is the real issue: managers use their relievers incorrectly, and Girardi appears to be no cleverer in this regard.

Go to it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[62] If everyone make the same &#8220;inexplicable&#8221; decision, then surely it is not &#8220;inexplicable&#8221;&#8230;.and this is not a matter of simple semantics.  Your own analysis of the situation betrays your hyperbolic rhetoric.</p>
<p>Look, if we want to have a reasonable discussion about how managers misuse their relievers, I&#8217;m all for it.  By now you should know that I agree in general with that premise.</p>
<p>But using over the top rhetoric does not further the discussion, and in fact often clouds it.  What we are really talking about now is not whether Girardi did something that was inexplicable (i.e., unexplainable, incomprehensible, etc.).  Rather we are speaking about the much more mundane: that Girardi does not rise above very predicable tendencies of most MLB managers.</p>
<p>Now that we have dispensed with the hyperbole, we can continue the discussion, and focus on what then is the real issue: managers use their relievers incorrectly, and Girardi appears to be no cleverer in this regard.</p>
<p>Go to it.</p>
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		<title>By: Raf</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244228</link>
		<dc:creator>Raf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 20:50:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244228</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;I don’t really care that most managers would make the same inexplicable decision. &lt;/b&gt;

If most managers would make that decision, how is it inexplicable?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>I don’t really care that most managers would make the same inexplicable decision. </b></p>
<p>If most managers would make that decision, how is it inexplicable?</p>
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		<title>By: williamnyy23</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244227</link>
		<dc:creator>williamnyy23</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 20:27:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244227</guid>
		<description>[61] Coke had fine numbers against lefties (although the HRs did happen), but two of the lefties hit LH&#039;ers and one the righty he faced mauls them. Going to Coke over Hughes was a colossal mistake, in my opinion.  I don&#039;t really care that most managers would make the same inexplicable decision. All I care about is that Girardi did something so incredibly wrong, and it could have cost the team a chance to win the World Series.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[61] Coke had fine numbers against lefties (although the HRs did happen), but two of the lefties hit LH&#8217;ers and one the righty he faced mauls them. Going to Coke over Hughes was a colossal mistake, in my opinion.  I don&#8217;t really care that most managers would make the same inexplicable decision. All I care about is that Girardi did something so incredibly wrong, and it could have cost the team a chance to win the World Series.</p>
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		<title>By: monkeypants</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244226</link>
		<dc:creator>monkeypants</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:54:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244226</guid>
		<description>[50] &lt;i&gt;Girardi had no reason to think that Coke’s left handedness made him the right man for the job, so using that a reason is as inexplicable as the decision itself.&lt;/i&gt;

And yet, as demonstrated earlier, Coke DID have fine numbers v. LH batters this year, though he has been prone to the long ball.  If Marte could not go, Coke was not the worst option, in my mind.  At that point Girardi has one lefty to go to against the meat of their order.  

Now I for one am not so hung up lefty-righty match ups, an i would have gone with Hughes (probably).  But eliminating the reductio ad absurdum of jumping out a window to save time, using your one lefty available in the pen to go after their tough lefties is by no means *inexplicable*within the context of typical baseball strategy, as employed by managers these days. 

&lt;i&gt;In all serious, semantics aside, the Coke decision was a pivotal mistake, in my opinion.&lt;/i&gt;

Mistake or not, I agree...he ended up allowing to lead to balloon to a much tougher deficit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[50] <i>Girardi had no reason to think that Coke’s left handedness made him the right man for the job, so using that a reason is as inexplicable as the decision itself.</i></p>
<p>And yet, as demonstrated earlier, Coke DID have fine numbers v. LH batters this year, though he has been prone to the long ball.  If Marte could not go, Coke was not the worst option, in my mind.  At that point Girardi has one lefty to go to against the meat of their order.  </p>
<p>Now I for one am not so hung up lefty-righty match ups, an i would have gone with Hughes (probably).  But eliminating the reductio ad absurdum of jumping out a window to save time, using your one lefty available in the pen to go after their tough lefties is by no means *inexplicable*within the context of typical baseball strategy, as employed by managers these days. </p>
<p><i>In all serious, semantics aside, the Coke decision was a pivotal mistake, in my opinion.</i></p>
<p>Mistake or not, I agree&#8230;he ended up allowing to lead to balloon to a much tougher deficit.</p>
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		<title>By: The Hawk</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244225</link>
		<dc:creator>The Hawk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:53:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244225</guid>
		<description>[58] I really think because he was &quot;right&quot; about Burnett, Francesa is high as a kite.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[58] I really think because he was &#8220;right&#8221; about Burnett, Francesa is high as a kite.</p>
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		<title>By: The Hawk</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244224</link>
		<dc:creator>The Hawk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:52:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244224</guid>
		<description>[57] That&#039;s fine, my point was that Francesa said Girardi rolled the dice with AJ, as if it wouldn&#039;t be a roll of the dice either way, which it would have been. I was never big on pitching AJ there anyway, though I don&#039;t think it played out as most objectors thought. The big question, I believe, will be answered tonight with Pettitte.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[57] That&#8217;s fine, my point was that Francesa said Girardi rolled the dice with AJ, as if it wouldn&#8217;t be a roll of the dice either way, which it would have been. I was never big on pitching AJ there anyway, though I don&#8217;t think it played out as most objectors thought. The big question, I believe, will be answered tonight with Pettitte.</p>
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		<title>By: Rich</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244223</link>
		<dc:creator>Rich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:47:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244223</guid>
		<description>There seems to be a logical inconsistency in advocating that a 40 year old Rivera can pitch three innings based on what he did in 2003, but then simultaneously arguing that a 38 year old starter can&#039;t pitch on three days rest because he last did in 2003 (or whenever it was).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There seems to be a logical inconsistency in advocating that a 40 year old Rivera can pitch three innings based on what he did in 2003, but then simultaneously arguing that a 38 year old starter can&#8217;t pitch on three days rest because he last did in 2003 (or whenever it was).</p>
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		<title>By: williamnyy23</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244222</link>
		<dc:creator>williamnyy23</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:30:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244222</guid>
		<description>[56] I know, but I am saying that while AJ on the road/3-days was a better dice roll than Guadin, it eliminated a safer bet in game 6 (AJ at home). As a  result, Girardi has to roll the dice again with Andy on three days rest. THATS the gamble that I think was unnecessary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[56] I know, but I am saying that while AJ on the road/3-days was a better dice roll than Guadin, it eliminated a safer bet in game 6 (AJ at home). As a  result, Girardi has to roll the dice again with Andy on three days rest. THATS the gamble that I think was unnecessary.</p>
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		<title>By: The Hawk</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244221</link>
		<dc:creator>The Hawk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:25:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244221</guid>
		<description>[55] I didn&#039;t say AJ at home was a dice roll. I&#039;m saying pitching Gaudin would have been a dice roll.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[55] I didn&#8217;t say AJ at home was a dice roll. I&#8217;m saying pitching Gaudin would have been a dice roll.</p>
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		<title>By: williamnyy23</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244220</link>
		<dc:creator>williamnyy23</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:23:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244220</guid>
		<description>[53] I don&#039;t think AJ at home on full rest is a dice roll. Girardi gave that up to start AJ on the road with 3-days and Andy with 3-days. That is the gamble he took...not going with AJ over Gaudin.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[53] I don&#8217;t think AJ at home on full rest is a dice roll. Girardi gave that up to start AJ on the road with 3-days and Andy with 3-days. That is the gamble he took&#8230;not going with AJ over Gaudin.</p>
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		<title>By: The Hawk</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244219</link>
		<dc:creator>The Hawk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:19:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244219</guid>
		<description>[53] Duh, I meant for [51] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[53] Duh, I meant for [51] </p>
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		<title>By: The Hawk</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244218</link>
		<dc:creator>The Hawk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:19:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244218</guid>
		<description>[46] I know he rolled the dice, but I&#039;m saying it was a dice roll either way.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[46] I know he rolled the dice, but I&#8217;m saying it was a dice roll either way.</p>
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		<title>By: The Hawk</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244217</link>
		<dc:creator>The Hawk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:18:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244217</guid>
		<description>[47] It was really awful - I even posted something yesterday about it. I was taken aback.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[47] It was really awful &#8211; I even posted something yesterday about it. I was taken aback.</p>
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		<title>By: williamnyy23</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244216</link>
		<dc:creator>williamnyy23</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:15:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244216</guid>
		<description>[46] Girardi did roll the dice though. However, the gamble was not in game 5, but tonight. No one is suggesting that Gaudin would have pitched better (I actually think they should have used a bullpen start), but many are stating that AJ on full rest at home in game 6 with Andy backing up CC in game 7 would have given the Yankees the best chance in these two games. I agree with that sentiment. 

[48] It is reasonable, but the first part turned out to be wrong. If the second part does to, then Girardi will deservingly take a lot of heat.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[46] Girardi did roll the dice though. However, the gamble was not in game 5, but tonight. No one is suggesting that Gaudin would have pitched better (I actually think they should have used a bullpen start), but many are stating that AJ on full rest at home in game 6 with Andy backing up CC in game 7 would have given the Yankees the best chance in these two games. I agree with that sentiment. </p>
<p>[48] It is reasonable, but the first part turned out to be wrong. If the second part does to, then Girardi will deservingly take a lot of heat.</p>
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		<title>By: williamnyy23</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244215</link>
		<dc:creator>williamnyy23</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:10:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244215</guid>
		<description>[45] To me an inexplicable decision includes no reason and bad reasons. If I jumped off my office building because I thought it would be faster to fly home, that would be a reason, but I&#039;d still say the decision was inexplicable.

Girardi had no reason to think that Coke&#039;s left handedness made him the right man for the job, so using that a reason is as inexplicable as the decision itself.

In all serious, semantics aside, the Coke decision was a pivotal mistake, in my opinion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[45] To me an inexplicable decision includes no reason and bad reasons. If I jumped off my office building because I thought it would be faster to fly home, that would be a reason, but I&#8217;d still say the decision was inexplicable.</p>
<p>Girardi had no reason to think that Coke&#8217;s left handedness made him the right man for the job, so using that a reason is as inexplicable as the decision itself.</p>
<p>In all serious, semantics aside, the Coke decision was a pivotal mistake, in my opinion.</p>
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		<title>By: Raf</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244214</link>
		<dc:creator>Raf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:10:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244214</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;Wow Francesa is so insufferable right about now. &lt;/b&gt;

When *isn&#039;t* he insufferable?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>Wow Francesa is so insufferable right about now. </b></p>
<p>When *isn&#8217;t* he insufferable?</p>
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		<title>By: 51cq24</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244213</link>
		<dc:creator>51cq24</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 18:56:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244213</guid>
		<description>[44] it&#039;s also reasonable to say that girardi was right in thinking that the yankees could get to lee yesterday, and therefore made the right decision to give them a chance by going to the better pitcher.  and tonight we get andy on the mound with a chance to close out the series.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[44] it&#8217;s also reasonable to say that girardi was right in thinking that the yankees could get to lee yesterday, and therefore made the right decision to give them a chance by going to the better pitcher.  and tonight we get andy on the mound with a chance to close out the series.</p>
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		<title>By: RagingTartabull</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244212</link>
		<dc:creator>RagingTartabull</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 18:50:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244212</guid>
		<description>[46] his &quot;interview&quot; with Sweeny Murty yesterday was the embodiment of everything wrong with mainstream sports media, talk radio in particular.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[46] his &#8220;interview&#8221; with Sweeny Murty yesterday was the embodiment of everything wrong with mainstream sports media, talk radio in particular.</p>
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		<title>By: The Hawk</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244211</link>
		<dc:creator>The Hawk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 18:40:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244211</guid>
		<description>Wow Francesa is so insufferable right about now. He&#039;s completely full of himself because he was &quot;right&quot; about pitching Burnett. He says Girardi &quot;rolled the dice&quot; - as if it wasn&#039;t a dice roll to pitch Gaudin! 

He really tailors things to fit his opinion and not the other way around. Talking about Rivera for three innings, he says Rivera said he &quot;doesn&#039;t know&quot; if he can pitch three - then Francesa says &quot;that&#039;s what makes it such an interesting question&quot;. Really? The guy honestly says he doesn&#039;t know if he can do it and that makes it attractive to you? I&#039;m sure if Francesa started with the idea that no way should Rivera pitch three, he&#039;d take that comment as evidence to support his point there too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow Francesa is so insufferable right about now. He&#8217;s completely full of himself because he was &#8220;right&#8221; about pitching Burnett. He says Girardi &#8220;rolled the dice&#8221; &#8211; as if it wasn&#8217;t a dice roll to pitch Gaudin! </p>
<p>He really tailors things to fit his opinion and not the other way around. Talking about Rivera for three innings, he says Rivera said he &#8220;doesn&#8217;t know&#8221; if he can pitch three &#8211; then Francesa says &#8220;that&#8217;s what makes it such an interesting question&#8221;. Really? The guy honestly says he doesn&#8217;t know if he can do it and that makes it attractive to you? I&#8217;m sure if Francesa started with the idea that no way should Rivera pitch three, he&#8217;d take that comment as evidence to support his point there too.</p>
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		<title>By: monkeypants</title>
		<link>http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/2009/11/04/yankee-panky-expert-texpert-choking-smoker/#comment-244210</link>
		<dc:creator>monkeypants</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 18:29:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/?p=25892#comment-244210</guid>
		<description>[43] &lt;i&gt;The bottom line is Girardi’s &lt;b&gt;has given up on Hughes&lt;/b&gt; to the point that he let a marginal specialist like Coke supplant someone who had been dominant for much of the season. That is both inexplicable and inexcusable.&lt;/i&gt;

Not to pick nits, but your own analysis of the situation betrays part of your conclusion. His decision to pass over Hughes for Coke may be inexcusable, but it is not &quot;inexplicable&quot;---you provided one possible explanation!

&lt;i&gt;I guess I don’t view using Coke to get the lefties as a good reason&lt;/i&gt;

Again, my point was not that it was a good reason...only that it was the obvious reason (to my mind). I am not justifying the decision, I am pointing out that is is explicable.

And see, you and I have now provided two potential explanations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[43] <i>The bottom line is Girardi’s <b>has given up on Hughes</b> to the point that he let a marginal specialist like Coke supplant someone who had been dominant for much of the season. That is both inexplicable and inexcusable.</i></p>
<p>Not to pick nits, but your own analysis of the situation betrays part of your conclusion. His decision to pass over Hughes for Coke may be inexcusable, but it is not &#8220;inexplicable&#8221;&#8212;you provided one possible explanation!</p>
<p><i>I guess I don’t view using Coke to get the lefties as a good reason</i></p>
<p>Again, my point was not that it was a good reason&#8230;only that it was the obvious reason (to my mind). I am not justifying the decision, I am pointing out that is is explicable.</p>
<p>And see, you and I have now provided two potential explanations.</p>
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