The Yankees no longer have any players (Giambi, Sheffield) forced into the field because the DH spot is taken. Damon is getting there and he probably will be sometime in 2010. Still, I’d rather have one bat too many than one too few. And if both Damon and Matsui are healthy they’ll be productive. If not, the Yankees have young options. It’s not like there’s an obvious alternative on the market.

There was only a logjam to people who thought that Nady was anything more than a league average hitter and a below average fielder who lacked plate discipline.

You mean like the manager and the GM?

The Yankees can afford “logjams”. And more often than not they work themselves out just fine. There was also a logjam for the Yankee rotation this year.

Which proves my point: length of contract does matter because it has consequences about how much a player will play.

How does a hypothetical “prove” your point? Jorge is still a well-above average player at his position. Whether he will be in two years remains to be seen. Since when has “framing pitches” been a measurable skill? And he’s never been good at blocking pitches. Catchers are usually forced from the position because they can’t throw out runners. That hasn’t been an issue for Jorge yet. The big worry is that Jorge gets hurt and misses significant time again. But if you plan on Jorge being an underpowered DH, and he does get hurt, you wind up with two weak bats in the lineup – the “defensive” catcher and a backup DH.

Jorge is a catcher like Jeter is a shortstop. Their value is so tied to their position it makes no sense to plan otherwise. That said, having a quality bench becomes extremely important.

The solution, imo, is to stop signing players whose defense is declining to multi-year contracts.

If you really think this we aren’t that far apart. The Yankees signing Damon and Matsui for two years, at most, is the best of the possible outcome in this dimension. It’s decent money on short contracts. The alternative is either signing Bay/Holliday for more money and years or trading for a guy like Dunn or Hawpe. Why give up prospects when they can get the same production for fewer dollars and no prospects on the free agent market?

No it doesn’t. There are plenty of examples of a younger rookie pushing aside a higher salaried, less talented veteran

The only reason that he would even be on the roster at that point is his contract. Cash thought it was dumb to give him four years at the time that contract was signed and that’s why he opposed it.

Which proves my point: length of contract does matter because it has consequences about how much a player will play.

I don’t understand what you mean by this. The solution to aging bats past their prime being overpaid is NOT to reserve the DH as spot to rotate them into and out of.

What is the solution? They aren’t going to cut them.

The solution, imo, is to stop signing players whose defense is declining to multi-year contracts.

In other words, how many games Posada can catch (in reference to [79]) is an issue independent from whether they should sign a full-time DH (i.e. a very good hitter who’s penciled in to DH most days). It would be highly imprudent, in my mind, not to carry a big bat to play DH on the thought that a one (or several) player(s) on the roster should DH some of the time in future.

The issue isn’t too many bats. The issue is too many aging bats belonging to overpaid players that are past their prime.

I don’t understand what you mean by this. The solution to aging bats past their prime being overpaid is NOT to reserve the DH as spot to rotate them into and out of.

There was only a logjam to people who thought that Nady was anything more than a league average hitter and a below average fielder who lacked plate discipline. He would have played his way out of the rotation even if he didn’t get hurt.

Like it isn’t foreseeable that a catcher who has already sustained a significant defensive decline won’t continue to decline at 40?

It’s not about being worried. It’s merely about prudent decision making.

It’s questionable whether he can continue to catch 100 games in 2010.

The issue isn’t too many bats. The issue is too many aging bats belonging to overpaid players that are past their prime.

I’m totally with you here. The Yankees have the money.

As for A-Jax and Montero, I not saying to bank on them in 2010. But they’re not bad insurance to have in case of injury to Damon and Matsui. Sign both and have the youngsters in AAA.

Sign Matsui and Damon for $18 million/year for two years. They get two very good bats at best and 1 very good bat at worst. Likely it will be something in-between.

Then if they have the at-bats available, the kids (Miranda too) will get a shot. If not the kids have more time to develop.

Win-win. And better than dropping twice as much cash for twice as many years on Bay or Holliday. Though if Bay is signed, I won’t be complaining. Still, in that case, make Damon the DH for 2 years.

It ain’t my money. The Yankees have plenty of it. Ticket sales alone net them >$200 million.

For example, Chili Davis was signed to be the primary DH in 1998. That wasn’t the case

It’s not about next year, it’s about 2011. How many games do you think Posada can effectively catch at 40?

Someone wrote of Montero: “You certainly don’t trade him for Hallady given his age. ” Disagree as strongly as a man basking in a WS can! If the Jays ever did this, and Roy was signed for 4 years I’d be all over something like this!

It was me, loud and proud. If you think it’s wise to watch Montero be an all-time great hitter for another team in the division for 15 years in exchange for four or five years of Halladay, that’s your right. I think it’s beyond ill-advised.

Monkey and others are right on about Damon. I have no idea how the idea he’s fragile got traction or that he’s ‘mediocre’ as a bat. He’s durable and – especially in the Bronx – a very good bat. He is within a hair either way of Abreu, and will almost surely get 2 for $20, I agree. I also bet he’ll earn it, somewhere.

I’m not sure I agree with all the ‘logjam at DH’ arguments. I really don’t see playing Alex/Tex/Po/ even Damon if we sign him as DH’s very much. Many teams have a steady DH. We’d be one with Matsui, and his production is very good. The key here is the knees, obviously, and some sense of how often he can afford to have them drained. But I’m not bothered by a full time DH.

Someone wrote of Montero: “You certainly don’t trade him for Hallady given his age. ” Disagree as strongly as a man basking in a WS can! If the Jays ever did this, and Roy was signed for 4 years I’d be all over something like this! Halladay will be pitching excellent baseball at 38, I am willing to bet. That’d be a FIVE year contract. But it won’t happen – from the Jays end. They’d want a pitcher, too.

But having said this I need to be consistent and say I’d happily do Lackey for free and pay about the same. They will get better-than-AJ money, though.

I would be astonished AND gobsmacked if the BoSox do not give Jason Bay close to whatever he asks. They have nothing behind him in left. His numbers last five years are terrific. Not a great fielder at all, but has shown (unlike Holliday) he can handle the AL East (and Boston) just fine.

Paul…. every article I read from Yankee MiLB blogs were very emphatic that NEITHER Montero or AJax is ready for 2010. They both have raw talent, but it was said they both have a ways to go on the learning curve. Maybe a cup of coffee in Sept, but nothing we should bank on.

If we sign JD for 2, think about the ages of our players in 2011. Jeter, ARod, Posada, JD and maybe Mo. Those 4 guys had a great 2009. Maybe they will do in again in 2010. But in 2011? We will need a full time paramedic in the dugout. JD’s defensive numbers are falling fast and drastically. I truly love and respect the guy, but (unlike the 2002-2008 years) we must bring in 1 or 2 young guys a year. With Po needing a lot of DH time in 2011, and ARod and Jeter needing some, you can’t put JD there. I would trade JD’s .850 OPS for an .800 OPS with a glove and an arm.

I will say Paul, you are a very generous guy with George’s money. You want to pay 38 year old Andy MORE money then he made this year (because he met almost all his incentives) and bank on him not being injured? And where is Andy going to go? If he plays in 2010 it will ONLY be for the Yanks. $7m plus 3 or 4 in incentives ir more thn enough.

I do believe Bay and Holliday will be expensive. But it’s still a depressed market and I believe the Yanks have re-established themselves as the team to go to, to win, as well as actually being a fun and quality team/organization to play for. To finish his career here Holliday (30 yrs old) might take a front loaded deal like 5/$80m. I would try it at least.

Can’t go wrong with Matsui for 1 year.

While the Rays don’t want to help us, Crawford for some quality/young/cheap farm talent might fly. TB must always be open to trade 1 expensive player for 2 or 3 cheap guys with upside.

If I am another AL team, I see the Yankees as very strong for at least another year or 2. In 2012, Mo and Po are gone, Jeter and ARod are 39, JD and Mats are gone. Teams like Toronto and Baltimore may be better off reloading with young talent for runs in 3 years rather then trying (and failing) to compete with the Yanks for the next 2 years.

Once the core 4 are gone/in decline, and as ARod ages, it will be a challenge for the Yanks to maintain being the top team.

Lastly… I’m all for rewarding guys who have been loyal and productive for us. Give them cash, a car, a front office job, some hookers… BUT NOT a spot on the roster. You can not denigrade the team to pay guys back for past loyalties/services.

1. Re-sign Andy Pettitte; Joba and Phil to the rotation; Melanon/Robertson/Marte primary bridges to Mo; and IPK is a starter in AAA and waiting in the wings. (Maybe go get Lackey but I like getting cheaper and younger with our kids. If they get Lackey then either Joba or Phil can stay in the pen, probably Joba BUT Phil’s got less innings to play with next season than Joba does).

2. Let Damon walk. Replace him with Chone Figgins. Johnny is 35 years old with a lifetime .355 OBP. Figgins is 31 with a lifetime .363 OBP (.395 last year). Yes we give up 20 homers, but I don’t think we’d be giving up runs AND Chone has to have a better arm than Johnny.

3. Re-sign Matsui for 1 year as a DH only. He can keep the position warm for Jorge Posada for Monter or Romine in 2011.

4. Bring back Hinske and/or Hairston (I think they’re FA’s). They’re good bench players. Hinske may see himself as a starter though. There’s probably fungible bench players available not named Morgan Ensberg who’ll be available shortly. I like Hinske and Hairston because they play all over the field.

5. Keep Melky in CF for now with Gritner as the backup and AJax in the wings. Maybe AJax will be ready next year sometime, or maybe 2011. Of course, Figgins could play CF, but it’s been a few years for him at that position.

6. I would stay away from Holliday and/or Bay mainly because of the huge expense. If I get either it’s Holliday who had a 125 OPS+ in the AL with Oakland, albeit in 98 games, though Bay’s been solid and his loss would weaken Boston significantly. They may think Jeremy Hermida is the answer, but only if the question is “who gets hurt a lot and hasn’t lived up to his potential?”

The most likely scenario is they get 1.5 players for both years. Considering the cost and output of Bay or Holliday, that’s a bargain. You get the same production but in two lineup spots and the other half player is A-Jax or Montero.

also, i would prefer the yanks not give any of the old goats incentive laden contracts. if they are not performing or are banged up a bit, they need to have the freedom to sit them without having to worry about the implications of them losing playing time.

Also, re-signing Damon for two and Matsui for one means they’ll be well-positioned for the 2011 class (Werth, Hawpe, Dunn).