Comments on: I Don't Know – Third Base!

By: weeping for brunnhilde

weeping for brunnhilde — Fri, 08 Jul 2011 16:26:03 +0000

Oh, and Jon, I *love* this write-up, thanks! I love your report of crowd, Jeter’s outs and your own, very amusing blunder.

Almost like being there! (Seriously, very well conveyed, thanks!)

By: weeping for brunnhilde

weeping for brunnhilde — Fri, 08 Jul 2011 16:12:59 +0000

[7] [8] Agreed. It’s just the way things are and in this case, I’m comfortable just going with the flow.

By: a.O

a.O — Fri, 08 Jul 2011 15:52:51 +0000

[7,8] OK, so I guess I wasn’t missing any particular argument on the other side here, at least as far as you guys are concerned. So I hold to the view that post-season hits should count toward a player’s career hits record. And it also makes sense that they’re counted separately for the reasons you give in [8]. I’ll be satisfied if we start calling the 3,000 number “regular-season hits” rather than “career hits.” I’m not using those quotes literally — I just wish the distinction would be made more salient for the average fan. I guess I was aware all along that the number did not include the PS, but it just hit me this morning when I remembered that he has so many PS hits.

Just out of curiosity, anyone know how many post-season hits Pete Rose has?

By: Sliced Bread

Sliced Bread — Fri, 08 Jul 2011 15:38:43 +0000

7) exactly.

By: Sliced Bread

Sliced Bread — Fri, 08 Jul 2011 15:36:48 +0000

6) You make a great case for why those hits should count, and I don’t disagree with you at all. I just accept it as the way things are. But yeah, the hits should count as much as the games. But I guess since postseason games count more, so do the hits, and to accumulate as many as Jeter has is really amazing, and impressive. So maybe it’s appropriate that it stands as a separate achievement?

By: Jon DeRosa

Jon DeRosa — Fri, 08 Jul 2011 15:35:49 +0000

[6] Both POVs are valid. I am with [4], though, because that’s the way it’s always been.

We’ve talked about 300 wins, 3000 hits, 500 homers all our lives and always referred to only the regular season. I don’t see the need to change it.

Also, not every player is able to get to the postseason, capping their max games per season at 162. Jeter, because he plays for the yanks, often gets the chance to play in 175 games. If we let everybody play 175 games a year, it would be easier to get these milestones.

Postseason should be separate. But in evaluating a career, I also agree with [4], it should be a huge factor as long as they’ve had enough at bats to matter.

By: a.O

a.O — Fri, 08 Jul 2011 15:17:57 +0000

[4] So, this is fascinating to me. You’re clearly on top of the numbers. As you say, Jeter’s post-season play is equivalent to about an entire additional season of baseball. And those are extremely important hits, RBIs, etc — arguably the most important ones. And then you say you don’t have a problem with them not counting on his career total?! Why not?

Those games were all played exclusively by MLB players, they are not exhibition games, and they were at least as competitive as the regular-season games. I cannot find any argument for why they shouldn’t count.

The only plausible argument I can think of is that there were fewer post-season games in previous years. But with the original asterisk on the single-season HR record, for example, they still counted both types of seasons (154 vs 162) in the record books.

For me, the real issue is that this is framed by the media as “3,000 career MLB hits,” not “3,000 career regular-season MLB hits.” It’s a little mis-leading.

And it’s a little unfair to Jeter. He was a big part of why he got to play in all those post-season games. And that may mean that he had chances to play more games than other guys, but he made the most of them. The games count. So should the hits.

Anyway, I’d be interested to hear other perspectives on this, FWIW.

By: Sliced Bread

Sliced Bread — Fri, 08 Jul 2011 15:10:43 +0000

1) they’ve played a couple good teams, they’ve given up early runs which has forced them to press at the plate, and they’ve also hit into a little bit of bad luck this week, especially Swisher.Jeter’s return to the top of the lineup didn’t bring on any of this as I see it.

By: Sliced Bread

Sliced Bread — Fri, 08 Jul 2011 15:05:26 +0000

2) yeah, I brought up Jeter’s postseason numbers here a few days ago. He’s had an entire season’s worth of hits, home runs, and RBI over his postseason career. He’s put in an entire year of overtime since he came up. To put it another way: as a player, he’s a full production year older than he is. I don’t have a problem with those 185 hits not counting toward his career total, but they shouldn’t be overlooked during this pursuit.

Jeter probably values those 185 hits as much as the 2,998 others, if not more so.

By: Jon DeRosa

Jon DeRosa — Fri, 08 Jul 2011 14:12:30 +0000

[1] I think it’s probably not playing those crappy NL teams any more.

By: a.O

a.O — Fri, 08 Jul 2011 14:10:14 +0000

I just read this morning in SI that Jeter has 185 post-season hits, giving him well over 3,000 in his MLB career. It’s dumb not to count post-season hits. So maybe that will offer some solace for those who miss Jeter’s 3,000th regular-season hit.

By: kenboyer made me cry

kenboyer made me cry — Fri, 08 Jul 2011 14:10:04 +0000

The team looks flat since Jeter’s return to the lineup. Why?

Is it him? His quest for 3000? What is it?