CC and the Yanks look to make it eight straight tonight. Rain could be a factor. Let’s hope it doesn’t mess with a nice winning streak.
Let’s Go Yan-Kees.
Monday
June 17, 2024
Since 2002
"This ain't football. We do this every day."
--Earl Weaver
--Earl Weaver
love that song, gotta dig the very unusual santana-esque back half of the song ...
I'm "almost certain" that a rain delay wouldn't adversely effect CC the way it obviously does Joba...
I really think the Rolling Stones are an atrocity sometimes but that is a cool song.
just because Girardi doesn't like for us to wait for a ballgame without anything to talk about ...
(from Petey)
Speaking of delays ....
The Astros and Padres are delayed in the top of the 9th inning, due to a small swarm of bees that have congregated in left field.
(no joke)
[5] GIMME 5 BEES FOR A QUARTER!
One of the best albums ever.
But the above tune is from Sticky Fingers, which is actually my favorite Stones album (just ahead of Let It Bleed).
Here's hoping the Yanks run like Wild Horses over the M's tonight and make them their Bitch.
anyone gots the haps on the start?
LOVE that song! Mick Taylor and Keef were a great combo, easily the Stones best years..
[8] I was merely reacting to [3], Cliff. I forget to put the [].
Damn, I was really in the mood for a baseball game. What's the forecast down there?
[12] Rain, as always:
[5] Who/what do you think is behind this?
a. Global warming
b. Climate change
c. Apocalypse
d. Candyman
e. A-Rod
[14]
Michael Jackson
[4] "Girardi said it was because he hit “two rockets” against the Mets the other day with runners on base."
That's nothing!
The DPRK "launched" four of those today!
I'm feelin' all "July Fourthy" already!
Start time:
"20 minutes and counting"...
: )
[14] Better to have swarms of bees, than no bees at all!
: )
[14] Maybe that college basketball coach, the LIU guy? From like the 1930s. Famous guy.
[17] Were there two, or not?
That is the question.
(I'm trying to rack up some tacit 'bee' puns.)
Beehave
Ham says 7:40 start
are-bee-eye
Are we not men, we are Beevo
arrrr - bee - aye!
i think i need baseball
[21] Beeautiful.
[24] Beeneathe you.
[19] I saw a lot of blue dragon flies today, a couple of deer, a few rabbits, a hawk, and the remains of a gosling with just the head intact. Does that count?
[28] "Eric the Half-a-Bee" suddenly popped into my head, for some reason...
[28]
Alex Beelth?
[19] "Weather" 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer this...
Could a bee be CC? Eh? EH???
Ham says 7:40 start
I prefer to call him Pete A-Bee
[33]
10 CC .... The Things We Do For Glove ...
At least our comments so far have been benign.
goodness you all need to be quiet
[33] Carmine said "one bee," there are two!
arrrr – bee – aye!
Oh, no! We'll BEE having none of *that*!
You can wait til International Talk Like A Pirate Day, just like everybody else!
[35] I'm Not in Love with that particular pun.
Hey, baseball! Why didn't someone tell me?
Isn't this International Talk Like an Apiologist Day?
man, that ball was stung!
Michael KayBee on the mic
[43]
LOL
Speaking of bees ... one of the best fantasy baseball team names ever
Honey Nut Ichiros ...
[46] that is a great name. omar little would definitely approve.
Well, being behind isn't good, but CC looked good.
[14] f) Meteor strike.
[48] yep just thought that. and glad to have you back.
the next 4 games are all 1 o'clock starts.
So that's how a team scores a run with a man on second and no outs, without the bee-nefit of a hit...
Beehave
or Behive!
Johnny Bee Good!
[50] Thanks!
Good. I'll watch tomorrow. But I'm going to see the other Yankees play the other Red Sox, in Pawtucket, in the evening (with fireworks at the stadium to follow).
Johnny Bee-hooved... or not...
man, you wouldn't have to comb the minors very long to find someone like Vargas, glad that the Yankees don't hive anyone like him pitching for the team this year ...
[54] is molina going to be playing?
Bleh!
Not enough honey in the food room today, perhaps?
[57] Well, can't tell, but I think it's pretty likely. His rehab must be a higher priority than any other reason for some other catcher to play.
I'm hoping to see Melancon, and of course our buddy Ramiro, and of course some A-Jax action.
Uh oh. Meanwhile, back in the Bronx...
uh oh - this wasn't lan a or b cc
well, that sucked.
Why is it that when I get a game on TV, they all sort of look like this?
Well, that was unacceptable...
[62] hmm - maybe you should see a common factor :}
wow cc is leaving everything high
We want Hughes .... we want Hughes
[64] Trust me, I've thought of that!
Not a good time to lose my DirectTV signal.
This had all the makings of a trap game. C.C. has to keep it to three and hope the Yankees are more patient than they showed in the first inning.
[68] Not so sure about that.
It might be beer time soon.
(I meant the first sentence.)
[59] that's cool. i wonder how exactly the yanks plan to get pena time in cf with ajax needing to continue to develop.
let's hope william is right about the 2nd part - and this stays at 3
[72] I'm convinced this is a short term move to (try to) increase Peña's trade value before the deadline.
[72] Yeah, how serious is that plan to work him out in CF? I understand the idea is to increase his trade value? Seems implausible, somehow.
yes - gotta love when they over-slide
I don't really believe this, and it is very early in the game. But does anyone think that Damon should have let that ball drop foul so that the runner from third could not score.
[76] Remember, an overslide is the result of gritty hustle, so it actually does not count as an out. Thus, there is no reason NOT to overslide...unless, of course, the player is lazy.
[73] The key though is patience. I don't know how successful he has been doing it, but Jeter has been swinging at the first game pitch quite frequently lately. Results aside, you always hear about how important it is for a leadoff hitter to allow the rest of the lineup to see as many pitches as possible early in the game. That's probably particularly true for guys the hitters haven't seen.
[77] I'd say no. For one thing, there's a reasonable chance he scores anyway. And Johnny's out did cut down the chances of a big inning.
That's how you do it, Alex!
Here's Robbie...hopefully he has one of the line drives he hit against the Mets.
[82] Hopefully the Mariners play the same defense as the Mets.
[82] you mean a "rocket"?
[84] Exactly...who am I to contradict Girardi.
well hey - that was a rocket
Hey, a rocket!!!
Man, Alex is freaking slow.
Robbie Cano...Girardi knows!
Like I said earlier, Girardi's a GENIUS!
=)
[85] Girardi says "Fie on you, William"!
[87] It seemed like they held him up very early.
But that slow-footed A=Rod robbed him of an RBI :-)
Let's go Swisher...you have to get the run in here.
Very nice job Swish and Robbie.
Boy, the crowd was fooled on that, huh? Or was it something about the way the mikes were picking up the noise?
[93] done!
and moved Robbie up!
I thought Swisher got more of that. End of the bat, I guess.
Sorry, by [95] I meant that the crowed really roared as the ball took off from Swisher's bat.
[95] It was a big swing...even on TV, I was fooled. Then again, Robbie went right back to the bag, so he wasn't fooled.
the ball seemed to jump off the bat then hang in cf
Ichiro!!!!
ooh ichiro with the f-up - we do have the mets d again
...and somewhere Mr. Tokyo Jazz weeps.
[103] In his sleep, maybe.
[102] Thank me very much [83].
Ichiro's Strat fielding drops to 1 (-4) e1.
[105] thank you
ugly ab melk
It would be accurate to say that Melky expanded the strike zone that AB.
[106] Did you ever play "Gil Hodges' Pennant Fever"?
A much less stat-y game, but very fun.
Here's some food for thought...many have lauded the Sox acquisition of Bay and criticized Cashman for not getting him, even if it meant dealing a top prospect. Meanwhile, Cashman did pick up Swisher for only Betemit.
Bay's OPS+: 127
Swisher's OPS+: 125
[110] But Cashman's acquisition was only a salary dump by the WSox, so it doesn't count.
.
.
.
I kid, I kid.
[110] Wow, he's cooled off a lot, Bay has.
Canadian cold front, you might say.
Though Bay became a US citizen today.
Nice inning started by a walk. Hopefully Jeter, who will lead off the next inning, was paying attention.
[109]
Nope .... tried APBA, and Pursue the Pennant .... but Strat was the game of choice for the better part of a decade.
[112]
...and somewhere, Canada weeps.
[113] Hopefully CC gets his act together, too. I think the bats will get to Vargas.
[115] There's something odd about the "somewhere" construction when applied to Canada. As if you weren't quite sure where it is. "I know it's up there somewhere... no, that's Siberia... hmmm"
[117] I live here, but I most definitely am not sure it is..or perhaps more accurately, where it's at.
I like *this* version of CC.
That's right, I always forget you live in Montreal.
[120]
...and somewhere Montreal weeps?
: )
there is a lot of weeping in this thread, yet no weeping
Runs...
[122] Fortunately there has yet to be much gnashing or rending.
Jeterian.
Not exactly patient, but certainly acceptable.
Yay.
We need base runners for our home runs.
And they are coming, mark my words.
Johnny!
Not patient nor acceptable.
[122] I was going to post that...
: )
I don't get that.
Well, his success rate is very high, I guess. Still, doesn't seem like a good time to steal.
A once promising inning ends after about 9 pitches.
[127] when?
[132] Patience, grasshopper.
[132] No one can say. Probably when you least expect it.
[134] Is that because you just can't predict baseball?
[133] alright - i'll be patient since baseball is an unpredictable game [134]
rain season, humid
my tooth really hurts today
no Gameday, dentist..
Go Go Go CC!
Get through to seven innings
back later, see us win
cc is back to being hittable cc
ugg
I'm sorry, Mr. OK. I guess it must be 2:30 over there, huh?
wooh thank goodness
Makeup speed.
crapola
CC has suboptimal command.
Damn--every ball hit hard.
This is not how I had hoped this game would progress. With both Boston and TB idle, it would be shame to drop this one.
[146] Would it be less of a shame if they were both playing?
[144] And ridiculous velocity, which goes to show you the importance of location.
That ball was hit hard, but Melky has to make that play.
sigh
That's where not having high end speed hurts.
Live I didn't see how close that was to being caught!
[147] No, but from a physchological standpoint, it's a free half game that the Yankees are throwing back.
[140] 10am, morning
11:30 go dentist
CC losing, sad...
[103] If the M's lose, Ichiro's error will be on the front page tomorrow with the chinese character for "mistake" in a huge font..
[151] Lack of speed didn't kill Melky...iy was his poor jump on the ball.
[154] Oh, yeah, but I meant...
Tooth hurty.
What a frustrating game.
A true outcome for Branyan.
[122] What is the sound of one PJ weeping? If CC loses to Seattle, we may find out!
ok, please don't bring CC out for the 5th, Joe....give the big man a rest.
[155] High end speed enables OFers to compensate for poor jumps. Bernie did that a lot in his prime.
well, evidently i made the right call in leaving to go get beer
meanwhile, i'd let CC hit the showers and see what Hughsies' got
might actually manage to use him for more than 1 inning in this game ...
[161] I am not disagreeing with that; just saying if Melky read the ball, he wouldn't have needed it.
More patience needed.
The offense hasn't trailed in a while, so there is no reason they shouldn't be able to work their ABs and chip away.
Close pitch, but it looked like he chased ball 4.
True, this would be a good Hughes opportunity. If we score a couple -- otherwise it might just be a waste of Hughes.
[160] Just so it's not seen as a second guess, I agree. It would be a mistake to keep CC in the game.
[162] I wonder how long Hughes can actually go, given his recent usage. Since moving to the pen, he has thrown 11, 63, 21, 24, 11, 27, 16, 9.
Don't you love it when Rob gets a base hit on the first pitch? It's so cool when he does that.
matsui!!!
Whoa.
Happier now, Mr. OK?
Go Go Hideki!
: )
Melky should had caught that ball. he had two miserable reads that inning. even ichiro thought it was a sure out... It was a complete back-breaker. t
I am also got greedy and want them to sweep!!
I'd hate to use Hughes down four runs. I'd rather give CC the chance to get two more innings. His stuff looks fine...I just think some of the pitch selection and obviously location has been off.
WTG, Mat!
Now I'd be okay with Hughes. Or, for that matter, leaving Sabathia in.
[168] So it's not seen as a second guess, i would try to squeeze one more inning out of him. Of course the Yanks just scored 2 with two outs, so that might change my thinking.
Naw, I'll stick with my original thought. Send CC out, but go batter-by-batter. In any case, I would not let him go more than 5.
[170] I love it when it's on a ball down the middle. I hate it when he uses the same approach on a ball off the plate.
[163] unless the issue was the carry on the ball. singleton mentioned that he thought the ball was an easy catch off the bat. ichiro certainly came out of the box like he thought it was going to be caught. he *should* have been on 3rd. standing. having a lemonade ... before the throw came back in.
[175] I would use Aceves.
[172] 嬉しい！！(very happy!)
Matsui is such a good hitter..with those awful knees he will still hit 20 dingers this year..I hope next year he signs with my Yakult Swallows though he'll likely go back to the Yomiuri Giants..
[180] Good point, Ichiro was definitely coasting.
[180] Now that's just silly. We all know there is no sense at all that the ball carries more at the new Yankee Stadium/
Why CC? So he can avoid the loss if we get two, of course--typical baseball logic........
[182] Yeah, I heard he might sign with the Swallows.
[169] uh, several, i'd expect
I don't care nearly as much about the score as i do about actually making sure Hughes hits his innings limit this year, which is going to essentially be impossible as a 1 inning reliever.
[185] Veteran-ness privilege.
[185] [188] If I'm the manager, I would tend to be more patient with my best picture. I have no problem with pushing CC for another inning, and it has nothing to do with him getting a W.
[185] My guess is that it's as simple as: Girardi thought CC had a good inning left, and wanted to use it.
More runs...
[185] when will pitchers & managers realize how absurd the "win" stat is?? i guess never as long as guys get the Cy Young award for high win totals (and the subsequent contracts..halllllo Barry Zito!)
[189] Do you really think CC is the best picture? I mean, sure, he's good-looking...
alrighty, let's get us some runs
and now, with only 9 pitches in the 5th, i'd send CC back out, at least to start, the 6th ...
In fact, with that relatively quick inning (9 pitches, total 90), I would run CC back out there in the sixth (retracting what I said at [178]). Again, batter-by-batter. He'll hit 100 in the sixth anyway, so someone should be warming...like Mr. Hughes.
[193] : )
[195] missed it by thaaaaaaaaat much!
=)
CC has been hit really hard. 9 hits and some hard outs. Not his day.
Maybe it's time for Cervelli to go back to AAA...
That's an awful AB by Cervelli...and one reason why I won't be too sad when Molina returns.
[199] If that's the test, why is Ransom still here? ;)
[199] but he's drreeeeeeeaaaaaaammmmmmyyyyy!
and *boy* can he sell jeans!
[170] Don't you love it when they win the first two games of a series, and play the third one like they already did their job?
Apparently, CC has trouble with rain delays, too...
Bah!
With any patience in this inning, I think Batista would have loaded the bases on walks. I don't get the thinking behind all three of those ABs.
[200] I'll remind you of that when Molina has an awful AB...
Okay, big guy, couple outs, please?
Take CC out.
[206] Glug.
[205] Very fair, but if both are going to look awful, I would rather Cervelli look awful at AAA where he can develop his game some.
meh.
i think it's time for Hughesy
Molina's defense has been uncharacteristically bad this season.
If CC has a Livan Hernandez rubber arm, I'm OK with leaving him in. Otherwise, why not an 80-pitch outing when he doesn't have it? How much are 20 more pitches of sub-prime CC worth?
cano is *very* good at those popups behind 2nd.
like jeterian, even ...
[212] One of the things I respect the most about Boby Cox is his willingness to let his starting pitchers, especially his better pitchers, work through a tough spot. We'll see tonigh...maybe CC gives up a bomb here with two outs. Or maybe Girardi, crazy like a fox, trusts CC to get through the sixth. If he does, then he has successfully stolen two innings.
Joba's on an innings count. Might they put him in the BP in late August and give Hughes his last 4/5 starts? The Yankees are intentionally NOT giving Hughes innings. They must have something in mind.
Lots of farting around here...is he going to pull CC now, or let him face the three true outcomes?
Part of the reason for CC's playoff failures has probably been overuse in the regular season. Tonight was an opportunity to lighten the load.
let's just say I don't love IBBing the singles hitter in front of Branyan w tiring CC QUITE as much as Sterling does.....
[205] Which is why I wouldn't shed a tear if Molina didn't return.
[215] They must have something in mind.
One would hope.
Do it, CC.
OK, THAT might be the last pitch for CC.
Now the reliever has to pitch with the bases load. Jeez.
The pitch selection in that AB was very questionable. Three straight curves in the dirt seemed pretty excessive.
I guess that was low, because it sure as hell had the corner.
Unacceptable outing for CC... especially against Seattle.
Aceves has had very little work lately. Hopefully, he has his command.
[220] I think the Yankees made a LOT of mistakes on YSII. I think the FO makes mistakes. The Steinettes don't know much about baseball. But I think Cashman is smart. I think they have a plan. It's hard to believe they are not as baseball smart are we Banterers.
Would anyone have had the balls to bring Mo in here?
Aces!
VULTURE!
excellent. Now for the bats...
Now it's time to work on Batista. No more swinging from the heels like last inning.
I'll see your Kink and raise you an Ace!
[228] Me. But then again, I would not have a "closer," and I would be fired the first time my BP use appeared not to work.
Show'em how it's done Arod.
[235] Not like that. Did the Yankees get the scouting report on Batista? Don't they know he likes to walk batters?
The first two ABs do not inspire confidence.
Incredible that it takes Cano for a Yankee hitter to finally show some patience.
wow, the rest of this lineup should be embarrassed ... Cano just worked a walk off Batista.
sheesh.
[238] Bizarro gameplan?
...
I still have optimism. Next inning the levy breaks!
[228] But I think Cashman is smart. I think they have a plan.
I think Cashman has two weaknesses: 1) by his own admission, he is not a talent evaluator, so he has to rely on others. Even though he has revamped the scouting staff, I'm not sure some of their player personnel people are top tier. For example, although I think Oppenheimer has done a good job, I think there are organizations that draft better; 2) he hasn't had the ultimate authority on every contract, e.g;, A-Rod's and Posada's. I think the length of both contracts may constrain what he can do, assuming he is still here.
I also think he made a mistake by hiring Girardi, but tbh, I wanted him too.
[242] Maybe if the Mariners bring in a pitcher who throws strikes because it seems like the Yankees aren't interested in allowing Batista to walk them.
where the hell was *that*?
this crowd is DEAD to me.
[244] Faith, grasshopper.
[246] This game is dead. There have been alot of runs, but it almost seems as if the Yankees are kind of going through the motions.
Ooooooo...Johjima is crazy...like a fox.
Can we give her a day at the Stadium and then retire Kate Smith?
[250] I think they should limit GBA to only days when they have someone sing it live.
[246] no, no, no.
they didn't *seem* dead to me.
they did the WAVE.
they ARE dead to me.
like Fredo, ya know???
Too early to PR.
Wheels, please!
Ok, who let the big lizard out?
: )
Ichiro takes his time getting that ball to let his fellow countryman hobble gracefully into 2nd base.
At least advance Mat to 3B.
Hey, Hey. It's been awhile since a nice comeback win. Way to get it rollin', Godzilla!
Incredible how he doesn't PH here. This is another late game, awful decision (if Posada is healthy).
hmmm ... won't know what to make of this until we know (if we ever actually know) about JoPo's status ...
A promising start suddenly looks...not so promising...
Even if you hit Hinske and have Posada catch, you can't give away an out like that.
[260] If Posada plays tomorrow, it's an awful decision. If he doesn't, it might be acceptable.
that was Aqualung filthy ...
Right, they're just setting them up...
[263] i reserve the right to be pissed at some point in the future; I figure i'll just wait and see what everybody says ...
This is one of the games you can't believe the Yankees are losing...and then the Mariners are shaking hands on the field.
Posada hurt acceptable. Posada healthy unacceptable. Whaaaa...... : D
Sweet Play, JD.
He looked safe...anyway, Damon played that poorly.
Way to bee, JD!
Po's got a thumb thingy...
Got a bad foul tip from a Mo pitch.
Po's thumb got cut?
The Yankees have had an icredible amount of bad swings in this game.
I never understand why the Yankees get into these hack happy modes. For some reason, they start swinging at everything, thereby making quick outs.
Hmm. Are the Yankees giving this game away? The ABs seem to be lackluster here in the 8th.
sigh...I hate losing...especially to this crappy team with our Ace starting.
Figures.
"Is is high it is far it is ... caught by Guttierez in front of the wall!"
Great.
I wish the Yankees played in the NL East because then it wouldn't be such a big deal when the team decides to take a night off.
"That ball is HIGH, it is FAR.....ITIS!!!!!!!! caught at the track by Guiterrez
John Sterling, bottom of the 8th inning, 7/2/09 10:18 p.m.
[274] I think it's HR-itis. It's almost like they don't want to work hard enough to get a multi-hit rally, just bash a couple and tie it up.
Well, that's a big fly.
Ewww
LOL Hawk...so much for listening to Harry Moskowitz call a game!
So long and good night.
I'm shocked that Girardi left Aceves in this long.
And now Branyan contributes the third true outcome.
That's the ballgame. Pretty shameful effort by the Yankees against an awful team.
Meanwhile, the offense still hasn't come around since Fenway.
Why go to the bullpen now?
[285] It's rough out here!
[287] I was wondering why he sent him out for another inning, but since I'm not watching I figured he was looking real sharp or something.
Tonight's Haiku by PJ
Speed = Error
Two-run HR = Click
It's too late now Joe.
G'night folks...
[281] For the record, it sounded like Michael Kay seemed to think it was gone also...
They ought to fire Girardi now. Off with his head!*
*figuratively
[294] It definitely looked good off the bat.
[292] Like too many managers, he over relies on some guys.
[294] wow....that's surprising...
How are you Bama Yank?
That's a great play by Cano.
[294] Hmmm, mighty suspicious. Two dumbasses come to the same incorrect conclusion ... ; )
I'm surprised that's the first time the restaurant got hit, what with all the sluggers we have.
[301] Hit the restaurant is a bomb...I don't think too many will make it.
[298] Man, I was doing pretty good until Melky let that one go over his head earlier... I just took my soon outside after that one to shoot some fireworks.
How have you been? I wished I could have made it over to Hotlanta with you and thelarmis... but with the new baby and all, it would have been tough.
[296] Yeah, I thought it had a good chance myself.
[302] Should be interesting to see what HitTracker makes of that one.
Looks like the end of the streak...I kind of wish they could have gained some games on Boston and TB instead of merely keep pace. Then again, it did prevent them from slipping further behind.
[289] William, you really think the offense hasn't come around since Fenway?
For once, I'd like to see Robbie get a hit after fouling off about 7 in a row. : /
Leave it to Cano to have a great night when the rest of the lineup doesn't.
[308] Any other requests?
[307] It hasn't been consistent. When you consider the bevy of awful pitchers and even worse defenses that they have faced, no, I don't think the offense has gotten on track. That worries me heading into a portion of the schedule that will feature some pretty good starting pitching.
[310] For Swish to cut down on his antics on borderline calls. Maybe he may get more. And for another extra base hit by the Hobbler.
[300] HAH! I found this funny blog on Sterling and the comments are hilarious...funny stuff... http://mikekenny.blogspot.com/2006/07/john-sterling-update-still-not-very.html
[303] that's awesome on the baby...now make sure you get rid of the python (Sorry I'm just being crass about some idiot I saw on TV this morning.
[311] wow, those are pretty big expectations
[313] That was an awful story...can't think of a worse way for a baby to die.
[314] But worthy of a lineup with as much talent as the Yankees.
That was ball 4 :(
[313] Thanks. She has been a blessing. Adoption is a beautiful thing.
"Watching" this on Gameday is pretty bizarre.
Great battle, but Matsui definitely went out of the zone.
Good AB for Mats with a bad ending.
Posada on deck, so it's official. Girardi made another huge late game mistake that could have had a major impact on this game. There is no excuse for letting Cervellli hit in his last AB. Once again, part of the Yankees uphill battle has been the strategy of their manager. That's insult to injury in a game like this.
Dang. Melky flies out before Kay can even tell us how clutch he is.
[322] Desperation > Necessity. ???
I'm out. Goodnight everyone, have a great 4th of July weekend...
[320] It looked like a strike on Gameday! Somebody set me straight like I always do to people who make similar claims.
That was a pretty crappy performance aside from Cano. The AL East is going to be so tight, that you can't have to many games like this. I was hoping the Yankees left these kinds of losses behind them in interleague play, but alas. Now, they'll face some good Toronto pitching, especially Halladay on Saturday, which makes Friday very important.
[326] Not the last pitch, but the one before.
[325] later man, have a great weekend. I'm going to check out the fireworks tomorrow night at the Barons game.
Congrats again on the new Baby.
Only 7 in a row. boooooooooo!!!! Just kidding. GogetthemJays. : D
i agree devastating game to lose... this game is all on melky, terrible game on both sides of the ball, especially on defense. the backbreacker "double" to make it 6-2 was entirely his fault. his at-bats were very bad and failed to execute on all of them.
[315] William -- that story made me sick to my stomach. I suppose I wonder "Is this really news?" more than anything. Do I really need to flip on the Today show and hear some shit like that? And then, of course, they play the father's 911 call, interview the other daughter (who's crying) and show pictures of this cute baby. UGH. Disgusting. I turned the TV off because Matt Lauer struck his usual sympathetic pose and said, "how did you feel when you realized your kid was dead?" I hate that piece of shit.
Sorry to go off topic everyone, but I've been thinking about that all day.
[332] I meant to say I turned off the TV BEFORE Matt Lauer did his usual fine bit of reporting....
[332] I had the same reaction. I think it is news because maybe someone will think twice about keeping a predator snake in the same house as their infant, but I don't get the need to show a hysterical girl crying as she describes how her sister was killed by a 9-foot snake.
Also, the program I was watching literally segued from that story into more Michael Jackson coverage, almost as if this story was a mere distraction. Sometimes the media can really make you sick.
The Rays lead the league in scoring with a decidedly non-HR hitting OF. But they do have two burners in Crawford and Upton. Just sayin' ...
By the way, baseball sucks. I've always wondered what it would be like to be a basketball fan...where your team always wins the games it should.
[335] Helps to have an IF with Longoria, Zobrist and Pena.
Why did the Yankees lose? Jeter, Damon, Tex and Arod were 1-15. I guess those guys were do for a bad game, but I really wish they would have taken a more patient approach. I also really wish Jeter would stop hacking at the first game pitch. It seems to set a very bad tone for how the team will approach their ABs (which I admit is probably just an illusion).
[337] Exactly my point vis a vis the "Yanks must get masher in OF" argument.
[334] I suppose that's what we get for expecting "news" on the Today show though...What I also hate is when they report on "American Idol" as THAT was news. If I ran the today show I'd tell Matt Lauer that if he shilled for another network's TV show again, I'd fire his ass.
Actually, I'd fire his ass if I ever heard him say, "How did you feel when you found out..." as a precursor to any of the following: "your son/daughter was dead"; "your husband/wife had died"; etc etc.
[336] Actually, I know what it would be like...the 1998 Yankees.
Oh and I really wish you guys hadn't brought that snake incident to my attention as I hadn't heard of it before and it is pretty disturbing.
[338] don't forget their ace gave up six ****ing runs. That factors in heavily.
[342] Sorry about that...I actually went out of my way to not mention in conversation for that very reason. Usually, I'm immune to the horrors that often come across the news, but this one really made an impact. It makes the notion of MJ's death being a tragedy seem very, very silly (and by no means do I mean to disrespect MJ or trivialize his death).
[342] sorry, man. We're as bad as NBC.
[343] That hurts too...although Melky's misplay sticks in my craw. If he makes that catch, it's probably a different ballgame.
The Yankees finished up a stretch against the Mets, Nats, Marlins, Braves and Mariners at 11-7. I hate to say it, but that's not good enough if the Yankees are going to win this division. Now, they have to play 10 against the Jays, Twins and Angels. Meanwhile, Boston plays Seattle, Oakland and KC. In other words, the Yankees could find themselves in quite a hole by the All Star Break.
Poor Melky was probably exhausted. According to Gameday, that double was the fifth ball in a row hit to him.
[347] Ha, yeah I am officially gunshy after their last coming out party/winning streak - thinking they'd arrived only to see them crawl back in their cave with their tails between their legs after the sweep at Fenway ... I'm not gaining much, if any, confidence from the last six.
If they make some hay in the next week or so against these three teams, I'll give 'em a little more credit. Especially if they get after the Angels.
[347] Unless the Yankees start beating Boston head to head, they aren't winning the division. It's just that simple, imo. Not only because of the direct effect on the standings, but because every time they get beaten up by them, it deflates them for a week or two, and late in that season, they can't afford that hangover.
[350] I agree, if they drop 15 games or so to the Sox, it will be difficult to make that up elsewhere.
OK, that was sarcastic. But really, I don;t think we need to get too complicated and worry about hangovers or other psychological effects. They need to beat Boston because they need to win as many games as possible.
For the record, I'm not sure that it is true they are "deflated for a week or two" every time they lose to Boston. This year they dropped three in a row to Bostin and followed that up by winning 4 of the next six, until the ran into Boston again. They dropped two to Boston and did, admittedly, follow that up with two more losses against TB. But that was followed by winning 11 out of 13. Only after the third time, dropping three to Boston, was there any real "hangover": winning only four of the next ten.
So, again, they are only three back from Boston despite having lost eight games in row to the Sox. Deflation and hangover has not been the issue. Losing all of their games to Boston has been.
http://tinyurl.com/l2dnob
Great JoePoz article on Lord Mariano!
[351] It's not complicated at all. It's as simple as counting to eight, the number of games they have lost to Boston this season. That is the primary reason that they are three games out of first place.
Every time they have concluded a series with Boston this season, they either lost the next game (as they did v. Detroit on April 27th and v. TB on May 6th), or they lost more games than they won over the next few (as they did from May 6th to May 12th when they lost 4 out of 6, and from June 12th to June 23 when they lost 6 out of 10).
You don't have to be Sigmund Freud to understand that losing eight games to their primary competition, many of which were in excruciating fashion, and then playing less than great in two out of three subsequent stretches of games against other teams, doesn't exactly enhance the collective confidence of the team's psyche.
Speaking of Freud, he might view sarcasm as a defense mechanism that a fan might use to parry the hard truths about the cost of those losses.
Then again, maybe you are correct that they can continue that one-sided pattern and still win the division, I don't share that view.
Truth be told, I actually think they will beat Boston in most of their remaining games, but then, I always think they will beat Boston.
[353] Every time they have concluded a series with Boston this season, they either lost the next game (as they did v. Detroit on April 27th and v. TB on May 6th), or they lost more games than they won over the next few (as they did from May 6th to May 12th when they lost 4 out of 6, and from June 12th to June 23 when they lost 6 out of 10).
Ah, so you are either playing fast and loose with the evidence, or changing your definition. Your initial proposition was that losing to the Red Sox caused the team to play poorly for the next week or two. This is demonstrably untrue, as I have shown. You have now modified that to losing the next game (which is what happened in two of three cases).
If you want to believe that dropping games "caused" the subsequent loss to Detroit (Apr. 26) or TB (May 6), I probably cannot dissuade you. But it does beg the question why losing to Boston and then a game to TB was followed by winning 6 of 8. Or why losing to Boston and then one game to Detroit was then followed by a four game winning streak.
As for the "hard truth about the cost of those losses," I am under no illusion the cost. As you point out, the are the reason why the Yankees are in second and not first. Rather, I posit that you exaggerate the cost of those games. There is simply no evidence, only a flimsy post hoc propter hoc, argument that the losses to Boston in one out of three cases caused the team to go into a longer slump.
Then again, maybe you are correct that they can continue that one-sided pattern and still win the division, I don’t share that view.
That's funny. I didn't argue that at all. Perhaps you should re-read what I wrote. In fact, it was pretty clear that intimated the opposite point--that they couldn't continue to lose repeatedly to Boston and expect to catch them for the division. I just threw out all the "hangover" stuff as unnecessary.
[354] Whoops, I made a factual error:
why losing to Boston and then a game to TB was followed by winning 6 of 8.
After dropping the series to Boston and the first game to TB, the lost the next 3 of %. But, choosing different data points, they won 11 of the next 14.
[354] Ah, so you are either playing fast and loose with the evidence, or changing your definition. Your initial proposition was that losing to the Red Sox caused the team to play poorly for the next week or two. This is demonstrably untrue, as I have shown. You have now modified that to losing the next game (which is what happened in two of three cases).
What's so hard to understand?
The first time they got swept by Boston the after effects were minimal.
The second time they got swept the after effects lasted a week (just as a reminder, the losses to Tampa Bay on May 6th and 7th count).
The third time they got swept the after effects lasted two weeks.
To wit, a week OR two! Why? Probably because the cumulative effects on their psyche were more pronounced with every sweep, especially after their bravado leading up to the third series.
Nothing I posted is counter factual
Evidence? Please, this is baseball banter, not testimony, documentary proof, or other items for which there is a chain of custody.
I think the facts, at least those that are knowable by fans, speak for themselves. They played worse after each successive embarrassment to the Sox, subsequent to the first series when they were able to shake off the sweep after one loss.
If there was no hangover, why didn't the opposite occur? That is, shouldn't they have just dusted themselves off and rattled off a five or seven game winning streak?
What's even more revealing is that the most recent time they got swept they lost to some less than spectacular teams, and were only saved from another loss by a once in a generation misplay by Castillo.
I don't know if you are being deliberately obtuse or are just having trouble understanding more than one interpretation of the facts.
For some reason you have an incredibly narrow construction of hangover. You seem unable to assimilate that it can be an incremental process rather than a uniform one.
It's a stimulus bound world view.
"The Rays lead the league in scoring with a decidedly non-HR hitting OF."
Well, their team is 3rd in the AL in HRs, tied for 2nd in the AL for Doubles, is 2nd in hits and leads in TB. And Upton has pretty good pop, but is off to a real bad start. My issue is not that Melky Gardner don't hit HRs as much as they don't project to have great OBPs. I'd be just fine with Ichiro in our OF.
While I like our speed/defense combo of Melky Gardner, the D really is not as good as advertised because Melky continues to take bad routes. I'm not really sure how Brett stands up in that dept. If we had the Rays OF D, we would have won yesterday.
[358] You seem unable to assimilate that it can be an incremental process rather than a uniform one.
I'm just trying to pin down the definition, which went from "a week or two" to "the next game" to "incremental".
In any case, I simply don't but the hangover argument because the evidence for it is nothing more than post hoc propter hoc reasoning. Of course, it can't be disproved either, especially when the definition is so flexible as to fit any set of circumstances.
So, we'll have to agree to disagree on the point.
We can agree, however, that the Yankees should stop losing all of their games to the Red Sox.
[356] If there was no hangover, why didn’t the opposite occur? That is, shouldn’t they have just dusted themselves off and rattled off a five or seven game winning streak?
That's terrible reasoning, I'm sorry to say. You have posited a hypothetical event of what *should* happen, and since it didn't, that somehow proves your theory. No! The burden of proof is on you to *prove* the hangover theory, which (as I understand it) is that a loss or few losses to one team somehow has a causal connection to subsequent poor play.
The only evidence you present is a post hoc propter hoc argument. But using the same reasoning, how can we tell that losing to LAA on May 24 didn't cause the subsequent losses to Boston? Or even that poor play against FLA and ATL led to suprior play during the subsequent winning streak? Or maybe the wins against TB in June cause the losses to Boston that followed.
*Should* the team have won five or seven games after losing to Boston? I have no idea what they should have done.
What’s even more revealing is that the most recent time they got swept they lost to some less than spectacular teams, and were only saved from another loss by a once in a generation misplay by Castillo.
I don’t know if you are being deliberately obtuse or are just having trouble understanding more than one interpretation of the facts.
I am not being obtuse at all. Moreover, I am open to more than one interpretation of data. I simply do not think that your interpretation of the data in this case stands up to critical analysis. But surely an open-mined, un-obtuse thinker such as your self can see where I am coming from, since there is more than one to interpret data.
I apologize for not reading all the posts in-depth but it just seems so bogged down in semantical tug-of-war, it's tough to wade through as a non-participant.
Suffice to to say that if you don't or didn't perceive the Yankees lapses after the last two Boston series, we're just watching for two different things. Btw, listing the Mets series @ Yankee Stadium as some kind of a bounce back series is crazy talk. But for a ridiculous non-play by Castillo they lose two out of three. Even the second game they won was freaky as it was a total meltdown by Johan Santana of all people, and the Yanks went on to lose 4 of 6 to the Nats and Marlins right after.
[360] I don't perceive the subsequent lapses as caused by the Boston games.
[361] Pardon me but you did say the only "hangover" was after the third series in [351].
[362] You are correct. Poor choice of words on my part.
I meant that the only demonstrable poor stretch of one or two weeks came after the third series. Thus, in only one of three cases could one posit that there was a hangover. The other two cases militated against this position. Overall, therefore, there is not enough evidence to prove that there is any meaningful "hangover effect," that is to say, a string of subsequent poor games caused by losses to a specific team.
[363] I think it was clear that the Damon home run in the third game vs the Os (after Yanks/Sox II) pulled them out of some kind of malaise. It was a huge hit.