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No Funny Stuff


Today’s Alex Rodriguez mishegoss is brought to you by Jonathan MahlerBuck Showalter, and what the hell, Jeff Pearlman.


1 randym77   ~  Aug 1, 2013 11:15 am

I can kind of see Showalter's point.

But as a Yankees fan, I'd love to see Matt Wieters in pinstripes.

2 Greg G   ~  Aug 1, 2013 11:22 am

Buck's comments seem a bit unethical for a manager to be making. Matt Weiters is probably wondering why he is being dragged into this?

Buck is in the same division, and obviously a rival and may harbor ill will to his former employer, but his comments, while not off base, do seem inappropriate.

Why would baseball change their policy just so the overspending Yanks are punished? The luxury tax was created mostly for the Yanks, and the Yanks will be exploiting one of the loopholes, but they did not inject ARod.

If ARod was still in is prime, his suspension would hurt the Yanks and that would be punishment enough. Are teams suposed to follow their players around and keep them out of trouble?

I don't believe for a minute Selig is looking to ban ARod to help the Yanks. His actions are a Godsend, but I don't think his intentions are to get the Yanks under the cap.

3 The Mick536   ~  Aug 1, 2013 11:27 am

That's the best Buck can do? A pox on all their houses. It may show how crippling the disease was and is and how ineffectual the cure will be. But, the reaching out to the fans remains in its infancy, albeit with due deference to the $10 tickets in Brewertown. What did he know about the plague and why didn't he, either as a manager or announcer do something? Not only should the players be banned, but the entire system, including the managers/coaches, apologists and wannabe lawyers, qua baseball pundits and anyalysts, should face discipline for sheilding the players and treating us like mushrooms. This is far worse than the strike.

4 rbj   ~  Aug 1, 2013 11:27 am

So Buck managed Alex in Texas, where he was allegedly introduced to steriods. But no one in management saw nuthin'. If it's ok to suspect players, I'm also going to suspect the ownership side. And MLB. And reporters.

5 MSM35   ~  Aug 1, 2013 11:28 am

Buck is a charter member of the holy trinity that rebuilt the Yanks (Buck, Gene Michael and Howie Spira) but he is off the rails here.
The Orioles finished poorly in the standings for many years. They should be awash in quality cheap players, like Tampa Bay.
By the way, no young stars hit the market these days. Buck is posturing to get his management to sign Wieters long term.

6 The Mick536   ~  Aug 1, 2013 11:30 am

How about Alex eating at Hooters. Must be on a diet or trying to learn how to live on less money. What did the lady friend look like?

7 randym77   ~  Aug 1, 2013 11:37 am

A diet? At Hooters? I thought A-Rod was the steamed fish and veggies, no oil, brown rice type.

8 bp1   ~  Aug 1, 2013 11:51 am

[7] A-Rod arrives to Spring Training in 2015 with a gut. Boy wouldn't that be an image.

I think Buck is right and wrong. Given the current situation, of course the Yankees will be delighted if they can get out from this contract and it would help them down the road. That being said - I'm pretty sure The Yankees would rather get what they paid for - a HOF 3rd baseman who is going to win games, sell shirts, and draw fans. Anyone who thinks the Yankees are benefiting from this Biogenesis mess is missing the point. They're losing an all time great ballplayer. The steroids mess screws up everything.

A dick comment from Buck, imho.

9 monkeypants   ~  Aug 1, 2013 12:13 pm

Buck's comments may be inappropriate---bad form---but he's spot on in substance. If the league suspends A-Rod, which the Yankees seem to want by all reports, it will effectively liberate the Yankees from one of their colossal personnel mistakes. If I were a Yankees opponent right now, I too would sense the irony. And that assumes the Yankees were completely innocent in this whole affair, something which my gut tells me is implausible. If in fact the Yankees knew Arod and others were juicing, or even if they were willfully ignorant, then it would be even more ironic for the organization to be effectively rewarded by Selig's hunt of the Great White ARod.

The thing is, I'm not the only one around here who thinks this. Several posters have been almost giddy at the prospects not only of the team ridding itself of the hated Arod, but freeing themselves from his onerous contract so the team can sign FAs and be more competitive sooner. I have read numerous, similar comments on mainstay Yankees sites like RiverAveBlues and RLYW. When Arod goes down, and he will, the Yankees organization will bizarrely benefit.

I agree entirely with what Cult of Basebaal wrote yesterday:

Frankly, I hope Arod fights this tooth and hoof until the arbiter smacks down Tzar Bud like the over-weening git he is, but still finds recourse to suspend Alex for the approximate time given to everyone else, so that Alex can come back next year, but never be effective again, booed by everyone, everywhere he plays, but that no matter how bad it gets, he never quits so that the Yankees are forced, at some point, to cut him and eat every last penny remaining on his contract.

They all deserve the worst and each other ...

10 monkeypants   ~  Aug 1, 2013 12:19 pm

From the Mahler article:

“The Players Association is a historically aggressive defender of its members. This is not like them. My answer is that it’s not like them for a reason," he said. "There’s something else going on here. It wouldn’t surprise me if there were lots and lots of hard evidence. The very fact that the Players Association is not criticizing Major League Baseball for dealing with this rather unseemly character tells me that there’s a reason they’re not doing it."

I wonder, too, if some of the reason is because the players themselves are more split on the issue. That is to say, maybe a good number of players are actually bothered by PED usage, so they are willing to sacrifice the perceived worst offenders. I mean, Frank Thomas can't be the only pissed off player or recent player.

There is also the political angle. The union may figure that defending accused PED users, even if it's the right thing to do, is a political losing battle. Maybe it's better politically for the union to fight other battles.

Interesting stuff.

11 Hank Waddles   ~  Aug 1, 2013 1:07 pm

I've got no issue with Buck's point about the salaries, but it's somewhere between odd and tampering (reverse tampering?) that he includes Weiters's name. He could've chosen any number of young players -- Matt Scherzer, Mike Trout, Bryce Harper -- but it seems counterproductive to single out his own guy, even if he's doing it to force management's hand. Now Weiters will have to answer questions about this, which can't really be a good thing. Very odd.

12 Alex Belth   ~  Aug 1, 2013 1:14 pm
13 monkeypants   ~  Aug 1, 2013 1:25 pm

[12] I just saw that, and Olney makes something of the same point that I did above [10]:

No, the greatest power in this whole fight is the strong sentiment of the players against the use of performance-enhancing drugs, which has slowly evolved over the past 20 years, with many speaking out loudly now.

14 Greg G   ~  Aug 1, 2013 1:59 pm

(10) I think a lot of the protestations of the players is posturing to some degree. If they don't speak loudly when asked about steroids the perception might be that they are users. I don't doubt that every clean player would like a level playing field. I also think that all players would like for the questions about roids to stop.

If the highest paid player in the history of the league loses a ton of money and is banned for life or the last 2 semi-productive years, that sends a message to all players.

This would no doubt have much larger ramifications if this happened when ARod was in his prime.

All ARod had to do was to stay clean and collect his cash. Barring that, when he got caught to act contrite and stay clean. Obstructing the investigation is what is most egregious. Alex Nixon Rodriguez cost himself a boatload of money in legal fees and potentially lost contract $. Maybe he kept taking roids because of his will to win, but he certainly has a strong ego, and my bet is that he did this to look good. (Torre's analysis).

Pettite's use of growth hormone will likely be a footnote after he retires and granted ARod is lightning rod, but he ruined what was left of his reputation. He is now staring at 2 years away from the game before playing again. (Maybe best case scenario) What will his production look like then? Sad! All that talent, but a 10 cent head.

15 Jon DeRosa   ~  Aug 1, 2013 2:38 pm

The Yanks can do a whole lot of damage in the offseason whether he's there or not. They've got about 55 million to play with next year with him, 82.5 without him and that's if they still stick to this budget idea.

What's really going to kill the Yankees is not being hamstrung by this silly self-imposed spending plan, it's the unlikelihood that any other decent player actually makes it to free agency. The Yanks may free up millions, but unless Clayton Kershaw is determined to wear pinstripes, he's never going to make it here.

16 RagingTartabull   ~  Aug 1, 2013 2:42 pm

has anyone here started banging the "Sign Brian McCann" drum for this off-season? No?


17 Chris   ~  Aug 1, 2013 2:54 pm

Buck is just saying what everybody knows: With very few exceptions, players go wherever they get the most cash. My dislike for ARod started when he was still a Mariner, and he told all the fans that he wanted to come back to the Mariners no matter what, that he wouldn't sign elsewhere just because he got more money, and he really loved playing in Seattle. He's been a liar for a long time.

But if Weiters doesn't sign in New York, it will be Anaheim or Boston. So that's just some good ol Yankee-hatin by Buck. I frankly find great glee in the fact that the Yankees get a mulligan on The Worst Decision Ever and it bugs Buck. Maybe we can plant some evidence on Tex and sign that hoss of a first baseman he's got too. You know, instead of watching the declining years of another contract that goes on waaaaay too long.

18 Chris   ~  Aug 1, 2013 2:55 pm

[16] Seconded. McCann for catcher.

19 thelarmis   ~  Aug 1, 2013 3:01 pm

[16] i've been thinkin' about that a lot lately. he's been on fire since coming back from the dl. hit another homer last nite.


20 garydsimms   ~  Aug 1, 2013 3:47 pm

[17] - Even though it Yanks/A-effing-Rod deal ranks in among the worst deals of all time, I'm starting to get the feeling that the A's signing Pujols may just surpass it as W.O.A.T.

21 RagingTartabull   ~  Aug 1, 2013 4:08 pm

(20)as bad as the A-Rod deal is, and we all know how bad it is. They did get 4.5 good years of production plus a championship out of it. That's obviously not what they had in mind...but you can at least point to SOME positives.

The Pujols and Hamilton deals OTOH might yet prove to be total and complete busts.

22 randym77   ~  Aug 1, 2013 4:12 pm

[14] That's part of it, sure, but that was true before, and I did not detect the level of anger among players that we're seeing now. They're being a lot more vocal.

Something's changed. Braun seemed to be the tipping point. Fans and players (including his teammates) felt he was guilty and got off on a technicality, but I'd guess there are many different factors.

The penalties - official and unofficial - are much more visible now. Melky being suspended 50 games, then benched by his team even after he came back. His PED use didn't help the team. Bonds and McGwire not getting into the Hall of Fame might have made some players realize 'roiding might not get them what they want.

I've also heard some suggest that the spread of steroids among kids is a factor. Players just didn't foresee that, the effects can be terrible when users are so young, and there's been a backlash among fans because of it (fairly or not - I know some believe baseball players should not be role models).

What's going on with concussions might also be a factor. Different health issue, but maybe the deaths of Junior Seau, Ryan Freel, etc. have raised awareness that there might be a health price to pay even after you hang up your cleats.

23 monkeypants   ~  Aug 1, 2013 5:09 pm

[21] I was thinking the same thing. Even if they get nothing from him from here on and they pay full salary, I am still not convinced it's the worst contract ever (and here I'm talking only about the extension starting in 2008). I'd have to look at the WAR-per-dollar value, and even that is somewhat misleading, because the Yankees have more money to throw around than other teams.

24 Greg G   ~  Aug 1, 2013 5:25 pm

[20] & [23]. I don't know if it was the worst deal of all time. But if you look at what they orginally had with ARod was a deal where TX was paying for a lot of his salary. When he opted out, they were off the hook.

Aside from 2009 the Yanks never sized up WS rings. Considering they had a lot of money to spend and the biggest chunk was invested in him, imagine if the Yanks had a 15 mil and 10 mil player that were into the team concept?

ARod was productive for part of his contract, but also a prima donna and a distraction. That said, I am glad they are rid of him. The way the league and fans are going after him is like he is Hannibal Lector. He cheated and he got caught. He is a jerk of a person and has a ton of money, but the kid had talent, and it is sad the way he is going out.

The Yanks tried to load up on every flashy free agent as they did in the 80's. Not only did they lack for team chemistry, but they found very few unselfish players who would sacrifice to win. They needes more complimentary players and less stars.

25 Chris   ~  Aug 1, 2013 5:47 pm

Yall are right, it may not actually be The Worst Deal Ever, but it's probably going to be close. If we're not going to go on straight $/WAR, then we have to consider intangibles - and just consider how much utter nonsense has come along with this guy. I think the Yankee brass probably figures even this ridiculous amount of money was worth the championship in 09. The fact that he was instrumental in that alone is probably sufficient to make the Pujols deal worse. Perhaps it's just the Yankees' Worst Deal Ever.

26 RIYank   ~  Aug 1, 2013 6:11 pm

Carl Pavano.
Kevin Brown.

27 RIYank   ~  Aug 1, 2013 6:28 pm

Lead off triple for the Mariners. Kyle Seager comes to bat with a man out and the runner still on third, and against the shift he bunts the ball right up the third base line.
I hope Teixeira has mlb.tv.

28 monkeypants   ~  Aug 1, 2013 6:53 pm

[26] Let's not forget Kei Igawa. I know it's heresy, but one could argue that Don Mattingly's contract was pretty bad: he signed a five-year extension after the 1990 season that made him the highest paid player in the game, and 1991-1995 were not particularly good to Donny Baseball.

29 monkeypants   ~  Aug 1, 2013 6:57 pm

[25] If we're not going to go on straight $/WAR, then we have to consider intangibles ...

I'm not sure I agree with this. Just because we use a different metric than $/WAR does not mean we have to reject objective measures altogether and rely on "intangibles." My point is that the Yankees have more money than everyone else, which lets them pay more for players and effectively pay more for wins. They can take on more large contracts without crippling their flexibility than other teams. So, perhaps a better assessment of the value of ARod's contract is to normalize it, say, by looking at WAR-per-percentage-of-team-payroll, or some such.

30 Sliced Bread   ~  Aug 1, 2013 7:01 pm

'm late to the Showalter thing.
Is he also suggesting the Brewers have to pay Braun, and that all teams who have suspended players have to still pay them, or is he just beefing about the Yankees potentially getting a break on the lux tax?
Because unless he's suggesting that every team pay its suspended players, he's talking nonsense.
I can understand why he doesn't want the Yankees to "profit" from the Biogenesis fallout, but then he should be beefing about every other team that gets to pocket suspended players paychecks.

31 monkeypants   ~  Aug 1, 2013 7:02 pm

[28] Wait, it's worse: Mattingly signed his extension before the 1990 season began. So, the Yankees broke with their policy on extensions and got the worst years of Mattingly's career (1990 was the low point) for it. Plus ça change...

32 monkeypants   ~  Aug 1, 2013 7:04 pm

[30] The Yankees would seem to benefit particularly from unique circumstances though, no? I can understand his frustration.

33 RIYank   ~  Aug 1, 2013 7:05 pm

[29] I wouldn't rely on $/WAR, but mainly because not all WARs are created equal.

34 monkeypants   ~  Aug 1, 2013 7:08 pm

[30] I mean, the Brewers don't really benefit much from Braun's suspension, do they? They claw back a few million this year, but then they have him for the remainder of his massive contract, through 2020 or 2021. But if ARod is given a lifetime suspension, that let's the Yankees off the hook totally. Even if he gets a lesser penalty of 150 games, it's going to represent huge savings for the Yankees, at a time when they are looking to rebuild.

35 Sliced Bread   ~  Aug 1, 2013 7:09 pm

32) certainly if it's a lifetime ban for Alex they do, and I understand his frustration, too, but you can't seriously complain about the Yankees without complaining about the rest of the teams who benefit. If you're beef is only with the Yankees you're talking nonsense, and as others have suggested, probably just posturing.

We're all talking nonsense at this point because we don't know what MLB has on ARod, and why his suspension is sounding so disproportionally harsher than Braun's.

36 RIYank   ~  Aug 1, 2013 7:18 pm

Papi batting against King Felix with one out and runners in the corners. He flies to RF. The run scores, but Pedroia is out trying to advance to second on the throw.

2-1 M's, now batting in the fourth.

37 Sliced Bread   ~  Aug 1, 2013 7:19 pm

something else Buck's not being honest about is this: the Yankees are a better team with Alex, and maybe even better than this year's Orioles, so the Yanks are getting screwed by all this too.

38 rbj   ~  Aug 1, 2013 7:21 pm

[28] Given the garbage they surrounded Donnie with, $ at least was some compensation. Maybe if he didn't have to carry the team on his back it would have held out long enough for a trip to Cooperstown.

Not that I'm bitter about that decade. No siree, not bitter at all.

Stupid, meddlesome George.

39 RIYank   ~  Aug 1, 2013 7:37 pm

The Mariners start the fifth with another triple! Two lead-off triples.

40 monkeypants   ~  Aug 1, 2013 7:42 pm

[37] But A-Rod being out now has (in theory) nothing to do with the PED business...he's still recovering from injury, he's not suspended That's Showalter's point, in part. The Yankees are stuck with a broken down old player now and for the foreseeable future. If he gets a lifetime ban, the team is free of their mistake (if one sees the massive contract extension as a mistake).

41 RIYank   ~  Aug 1, 2013 7:47 pm

Henry Blanco, batting .169, just hit a grand slam off Ryan Dempster, staking King Felix to a 7-1 lead.

Can't predict baseball.

42 Sliced Bread   ~  Aug 1, 2013 7:56 pm

40) ARod is on the verge of returning. If he's healthy enough to play it won't take him much to outproduce the other guys who have been playing third for us. He makes the Yankees better, and helps the Yanks chase the Orioles.
If MLB suspends ARod, the Yankees' chances of catching the Os are diminished.
That's all I'm saying. Buck knows this. He's just not being honest about that.
I also just think its bad form for a manager to complain in the press about another team's deals and finances.
I like Showalter but I don't like his remarks.

43 RIYank   ~  Aug 1, 2013 8:16 pm

Yu Darvish had 14 strikeouts through six innings, but didn't strike anyone out in the seventh, so his shot at a share of the record is almost gone.

44 RIYank   ~  Aug 1, 2013 9:30 pm

The Mariners lead the Sox 7-2 going to the bottom of the ninth.

Reliever Wilhelmsen puts the first four men on base. The tying run comes to the place with nobody out. New pitcher.

Oliver Perez puts the next two on base. The tying run is on second and the winning run is on first with nobody out. Ortiz steps in.

Ortiz strikes out. New pitcher.

Yoervis Medina blows his Save opportunity as Jonny Gomes drives in Victorino. Winning run in scoring position with one out. Eric Wedge appears not to be enjoying the game. Yoervis, neither funky nor cold, walks Stephen Drew. Bases loaded, one out, tie game...

Daniel Nava singles.

Second straight walk-off win for the Red Sox, but this was sure an unlikely one.

45 randym77   ~  Aug 1, 2013 9:33 pm

[41] I'll say. Boston somehow ended up winning, despite being down 7-2 in the ninth.

46 Simone   ~  Aug 1, 2013 9:33 pm

As far as I am concerned the Yankees made their bed. I don't want them getting out of this contract by cheating or scheming. When they signed Alex, they knew the risks. They knew what they were getting. No one told them to bid against themselves. They got some productive years and a championship with Alex so it is not like they are walking away empty handed.

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