"A New York Treasure" --Village Voice

Texas Rangers

Texas Rangers

2009 Record: 26-17 (.605)
2009 Pythagorean Record: 24-19 (.558)

2008 Record: 79-83 (.488)
2008 Pythagorean Record: 76-86 (.469)

Manager: Ron Washington
General Manager: Jon Daniels

Home Ballpark: Rangers Ballpark (100/101)

Who’s Replaced Whom:

  • Chris Davis and Hank Blalock split up Milton Bradley’s at-bats
  • Elvis Andrus replaces Ramon Vazquez
  • Omar Vizquel replaces German Duran (minors)
  • Nelson Cruz inherits the playing time of Brandon Boggs (minors)
  • Andruw Jones replaces Frank Catalanotto
  • Jarrod Saltalamacchia inherits Gerald Laird’s playing time
  • Taylor Teagarden replaces Saltalamacchia as the backup catcher
  • Derek Holland is filling in for Vicente Padilla (DL)
  • Matt Harrison takes over Kason Gabbard’s starts
  • Brandon McCarthy takes over the starts of Sidney Ponson and Luis Mendoza (minors)
  • Darren O’Day replaces Josh Rupe
  • Jason Jennings takes over Jamey Wright’s innings
  • Kris Benson is filling in for Dustin Nippert (DL)
  • Warner Madrigal is filling in for Joaquin Benoit (DL)

25-man Roster:

1B – Chris Davis (L)
2B – Ian Kinsler (R)
SS – Elvis Andrus (R)
3B – Michael Young (R)
C – Jarrod Saltalamacchia (S)
RF – Nelson Cruz (R)
CF – Josh Hamilton (L)
LF – David Murphy (L)
DH – Hank Blalock (L)


R – Andruw Jones (OF)
R – Marlon Byrd (OF)
R – Taylor Teagarden (C)
S – Omar Vizquel (SS)


R – Kevin Millwood
L – Derek Holland
R – Scott Feldman
R – Brandon McCarthy
L – Matt Harrison


R – Frank Francisco
L – C.J. Wilson
L – Eddie Guardado
R – Darren O’Day
R – Jason Jennings
R – Kris Benson
R – Warner Madrigal

15-day DL: RHP – Vicente Padilla (strained shoulder); RHP – Willie Eyre (groin); RHP – Dustin Nippert (strained back/side)

60-day DL: RHP – Joaquin Benoit (torn rotator cuff); RHP – Eric Hurley (torn rotator cuff)

Typical Lineup:

R – Ian Kinsler (2B)
R – Michael Young (3B)
L – Josh Hamilton (CF)
L – Hank Blalock (3B)
R – Nelson Cruz (RF)
L – David Murphy (LF)
L – Chris Davis (1B)
S – Jarrod Saltalamacchia (C)
R – Elvis Andrus (SS)

When I look at this year’s Texas Rangers, who currently boast the best record in the American League, I see this year’s Toronto Blue Jays: a team that has scored a lot of runs and played great defense, but has yet to be challenged by its schedule.

The Rangers enter this week’s three-game series against the Yankees with a 4-8 record against teams that are currently above .500. Three of those four wins came at home against the Angels. The only other winning teams they’ve played are the Blue Jays (1-2) and the Tigers (0-6).

Credit the Rangers for cleaning up against the league’s lesser teams, but a reckoning is coming. Starting tonight 16 of their next 20 games are against the Yankees (six), Jays (four), Red Sox (three), and Dodgers (three). Remember, the Jays had the best record in the AL when the Yankees arrived in Toronto two weeks ago. They then dropped two of three to the Bombers and have since lost their last six to the Red Sox and Braves, falling off their perch atop the AL East in the process. The Rangers could be in for a similar fall, though no one in the West appears ready to overtake them in their division.

The Rangers (or Texas Texases as some are calling them due to the fact that they no longer wear a uniform that says “Rangers” on it), are indeed scoring a lot of runs, but a year after leading the majors with 5.56 runs per game, their sixth-place 5.40 R/G feels underwhelming, particularly given the overall increase in scoring in the majors thus far this year (4.77 R/G up from 4.65 a year ago). Some of that is due to the fact that Josh Hamilton has fought oblique and groin injuries which have cost him both playing time and production. Part of it is due to the fact that, while Chris Davis and Hank Blalock have combined for 21 home runs, they’ve also combined for a mere .272 on-base percentage, while Davis is leading the world in strikeouts with 64 in just 42 games played.

The Rangers have gotten great production from Andruw Jones as the short side of a left-field platoon, and from Michael Young, who has flourished in the wake of his move to third base. Ian Kinsler and right-fielder Nelson Cruz are both hitting for power and stealing bases, combining for 23 homers and 17 steals in 19 attempts thus far, but the team on-base percentage is well below league average, and the Texases are scoring a below-average 4.47 runs per game on the road. Unfortunately for the Yankees, their playing Texas in Texas this week, where the Texases are 14-6 on the season and scoring 6.45 runs per game.

The Rangers’ pitching has thus far been a pleasant surprise, boasting a staff ERA comfortably above league average (4.41 vs. 4.58) after finishing a distant last in the majors in staff ERA last year (5.37 to the Orioles’ 5.15), but what looks like improved pitching has a great deal to do with a tremendous turnaround in team defense.

The Rangers were last in the majors in defensive efficiency last year. This year, they lead the AL and trail just three National League teams in turning balls in play into outs. The decision to move 2008 Gold Glove winner Michael Young to third base and install rookie Elvis Andrus at shortstop has a lot to do with that. Despite winning that award, Young was actually one of the worst defensive shortstops in baseball last year. Andrus, however, is legitimately excellent at the position. Young is still pretty bad at the hot corner, but Ian Kinsler has shown a sudden and surprising turn around at the keystone, and Chris Davis has been excellent at first base, giving Texas three-quarters of an excellent defensive infield.

In the outfield, Nelson Cruz has made as many highlight shows for his play in right field as for his power at the plate and has the highest Ultimate Zone Rating on the team. Josh Hamilton, when healthy, has been almost as good in center, and David Murphy has played a strong left field, while Andruw Jones, formerly the best defensive center fielder in baseball, isn’t doing the team any harm on his days in the field, despite the complete errosion of his skills that occured last year. On top of all that, Jarrod Saltalamacchia, one of the key pieces in the Mark Teixeira trade, is throwing out 36 percent of baserunners and hasn’t allowed a passed ball, and has made just one error all year.

Tonight, the Yankees face another product of the Teixeira trade, 23-year-old Matt Harrison. A big lefty with a sharp slider, Harrison doesn’t strike out many men, though his .307 BABIP suggests he hasn’t benefited unduly from the strong defense behind him. Harrison got off to an ugly start, posting a 9.20 ERA in his first three starts, all Texas loses. Since then, he’s gone 4-1 with a 2.83 ERA and a 5.25 K/BB ratio thanks to his walking just four men in his last five starts. His last outing, however, looked more like the first three, as he allowed five runs on nine hits, three of them home runs, in just five innings in Detroit.

The Yankees counter with Phil Hughes, who has allowed three runs in five innings in each of his last two starts, both of them Yankee wins. Hughes has showed an increasing ability to work out of trouble in those two starts. His last time out, facing what he thought would be his last major league start for the time being, he decided to stop futzing about and lean on his fastball. Hitting 94 miles per hour with regularity, Hughes struck out a career-high nine Orioles against just one walk, the latter being as impressive as the former given that he had walked ten men in his previous three starts. Still, Hughes did give up two home runs and has allowed six taters in his last four outings. Keeping the ball in the park will be especially challening in Arlington, but Hughes had no problem with that the last time he pitched in this ballpark, when he threw 6 1/3 hitless innings in his second major league start.

Categories:  Cliff Corcoran  Game Recap  Game Thread

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Show/Hide Comments 1-100
1 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 2:40 pm

nice Phil.

and Kevin Cash continues to demonstrate he shouldn't be on this team.

2 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 2:41 pm

VERY nicely done, Phil, way to battle back!

3 Just Fair   ~  May 25, 2009 2:41 pm

Well, that was clever. : )

4 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 2:43 pm

2 game threads and ugly red hats? I'm confused.

5 51cq24   ~  May 25, 2009 2:43 pm

a fist pump??? how dare he!!

6 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 2:46 pm

man, Teix is up to .272.


7 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 2:47 pm

I've come around on Wang. It's a terrible move if they only plan to use him in a mop up role (behind Tomko even) when he could have been in Scranton continuing his rehab. Just terrible roster management...again.

Gotta say if Damon keeps this up they have to at least think of re-signing him given what else is in the market and needing to fill three OF/DH slots. No more than three years though.

8 51cq24   ~  May 25, 2009 2:47 pm

[4] since memorial day started as a civil war memorial, navy would seem more appropriate than bright red

9 The Hawk   ~  May 25, 2009 2:47 pm

Damn that strike three call was a gift but I dare say we are seeing some improvement in Master Hughes. Fingers crossed?

10 Just Fair   ~  May 25, 2009 2:49 pm


11 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 2:51 pm

nice way to begin an inning.

double, walk, double, triple.

12 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 2:53 pm

extra thanks to the Rangers' D this inning.

meanwhile, Swisher is just awful right now.

painful to watch.

13 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 2:54 pm

i think that's just about as far as Ramiro Pena can hit a ball ...

14 51cq24   ~  May 25, 2009 2:55 pm

is 6-0 enough for me to go to the beach now?

15 The Hawk   ~  May 25, 2009 2:55 pm

[14] No

16 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 2:57 pm

I've really come to appreciate JD but 3 years? NO WAY! Even 2 is chancey... although we do need OFers. Maybe he goes as a type A FA?

17 51cq24   ~  May 25, 2009 2:57 pm

they're gonna stop the game mid inning???

18 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 2:57 pm

Well... I guess if ARod can fall on the ball he can make the play.

19 51cq24   ~  May 25, 2009 2:59 pm

[16] we need outfielders, not dhs who play the outfield poorly. it's going to be tough enough to find a position for jeter soon.

20 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 3:00 pm

very nice thus far, though i'm NOT looking forward to Cash leading off the next inning.

terrific inning for Phil!!! 38 pitches (eh eh). his ERA has gone down close to an entire run so far today.

still haven't seen the red hats. i think i'm happy about that, though there is some morbid curiousity...

liriano, is just not the same kid. boston now up 3-1.

21 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 3:00 pm

errr... anyone else just see the 'Hooters Swimsuit' commercial? MLB trying to attract a larger audience?

22 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 3:02 pm

[21] unfortunately, i did not. i don't have the game on tv. listening to The Incredible Jimmy Smith and following online. but i did see photos of that quarterback kids' g/f that Pete Abe mentioned. she is easily worthy of any swimsuit calendar, etc...

23 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 3:03 pm

[16] no maybe about it.

24 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 3:03 pm

WHY is kevin cash starting this game? why is kevin cash on the New York Freaking Yankees?!?! : /

25 Just Fair   ~  May 25, 2009 3:12 pm

One of the better punch-outs. Man, good stuff.

26 51cq24   ~  May 25, 2009 3:12 pm

that's a nice curve, but it still isn't close to what it was when he first came up.

27 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 3:12 pm

beautiful phil, beautiful!

28 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 3:13 pm

way to get outta trouble, kid!!!

29 rbj   ~  May 25, 2009 3:15 pm

[24] There are some questions in life that have no answer. That is one of them.

30 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 3:16 pm

@ 16

Not that I'd want to sign Damon for three years but I could see him getting that on the open market. With three free agents in the OF/DH slots (Damon, Matsui, Nady), the problem is who else is out there?

Here's the list:
Bobby Abreu LAA
Garret Anderson ATL
Rick Ankiel STL
Rocco Baldelli BOS
Jason Bay BOS
Marlon Byrd TEX
Mike Cameron MIL
Frank Catalanotto TEX
Endy Chavez SEA
Coco Crisp * KC
Carl Crawford * TB
Johnny Damon NYY
David Dellucci CLE
Jermaine Dye * CWS
Darin Erstad HOU
Cliff Floyd SD
Ryan Freel BAL
Brian Giles SD
Ken Griffey Jr. SEA
Vladimir Guerrero LAA
Matt Holliday OAK
Geoff Jenkins * PHI
Reed Johnson CHC
Andruw Jones TEX
Austin Kearns * WAS
Hideki Matusi NYY
Jason Michaels CLE
Xavier Nady NYY
Magglio Ordonez * DET
Manny Ramirez * LAD
Dave Roberts SF
Gary Sheffield DET
Randy Winn SF

It's not like there's good talent there, especially if Holliday comes around to only a .850 OPS. That's the thing - Holliday for six years or Damon for three?

Then it looks like A-Jax is getting close. That's Swisher and him. If they sign Damon, that's a pretty good front three with Melky/Gardner around to push A-Jax and steal time here and there.

Of course, I'd rather see the GM trade some pitchers for an OF prospect, but that will never happen. It hasn't once in the last 12 years.

31 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 3:16 pm

ooooh, me likey

arod's got as many non-hr hits today as he'd had since coming back.

32 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 3:17 pm

The only guy that I'd sign before Damon is Jason Bay. But I don't see the Sox letting him go.

33 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 3:20 pm

Don't know if Texas is the place to be making sniper jokes Flaherty ...

34 Just Fair   ~  May 25, 2009 3:21 pm

If I see anything this week as funny as Cano laughing at Melk I'll be shocked. : )

35 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 3:21 pm

nicely done, stick, nicely done.

36 rbj   ~  May 25, 2009 3:21 pm


Off to Home Depot for more dirt, what a shame if I missed a Yankee hitting a grand slam. . .

37 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 3:23 pm

[36] i'm just hoping for a Ramiro double.

38 Just Fair   ~  May 25, 2009 3:24 pm

Rats. That woulda been sweet.

39 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 3:24 pm

[13] correction, *that's* as far as Pena can hit a ball.

40 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 3:25 pm

looked like a pretty deep fly out?

that's probably it for harrison...

41 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 3:26 pm

I shouldn't count out Melky though. Too many people already have and he keeps finding a way to prove them wrong (at least in April and May).

Still, even if he has a strong year, would anyone here be okay with a Melky-Jackson-Swisher outfield? Seems like another bat is needed especially with no DH. They could also go the Vlad/Dye route, but Damon seems to be aging the best.

42 Horace Clarke Era   ~  May 25, 2009 3:26 pm

Sox would be insane to let Bay go, and they can afford to sign him. As Prexy of the Damon's Da Mon Society of Bronx Banter, I endorse all positive remarks made about JD, but I'd never go to three years for him. I'd happily give him a deal like Abreu got with L.A. though.

Cash is on the Yankees as a 4th string catcher. Not sure how many 4th string catchers can make the heart go pitty-pat.

Swish is indeed in one of his truly deep funks, alas it matches up too neatly with Matsui's. NOW can I get a tiny bit of love for Xavier Nady, and for why Cashman wanted to keep them both?

I do like those kids we have batting 3rd and 4th.

43 The Hawk   ~  May 25, 2009 3:26 pm

Unless he regresses, how do you figure Melky isn't a starting outfielder next year? And why assume he's going to regress?

44 Horace Clarke Era   ~  May 25, 2009 3:27 pm

Swish, dude, I almost take it back. Another rbi as I am typing that.

45 The Hawk   ~  May 25, 2009 3:29 pm

[43] And by regress I mean turn really bad again; I don't expect he'll keep up this level of production, but he seems to have turned the corner in his approach at the plate.

46 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 3:30 pm

keep it on the down low, but check out Carpenter and the Brew Crew game...

47 The Hawk   ~  May 25, 2009 3:30 pm

Year by year for Damon, that's the only thing that makes sense.

48 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 3:34 pm

wonderful game for Phil so far, even The Hawk can be satisfied with the way he's been pitching ...

49 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 3:35 pm


50 The Hawk   ~  May 25, 2009 3:35 pm

Okay maybe this is Hughes's first step to the next level? It's exciting to see when he pitches well.

51 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 3:37 pm

@ 42

My point on the three years to Damon is another team will likely give him that. If they let him walk over the extra year they're stuck with inferior players. Over one year?

The reason they're using their fourth catcher is because their first two catchers are 37 and 34 years old.

NOW can I get a tiny bit of love for Xavier Nady, and for why Cashman wanted to keep them both?

No, cause he sucks worse than both AND they had him written into RF.

52 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 3:37 pm

@ 50

Yes. Yes it is.

And this is a good lineup in a hitter's park.

53 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 3:38 pm

TB will pick up Crawford's option and then trade him. $10m is a good price, but too steep for TB, who has lots of cheap talent still coming up. Furthermore, in Trade, Crawford will get them a nice, cost-controlled somebody. Would the Yanks give up a good young pitcher for Crawford?

And if JD is a Type A, we do need decent picks.

54 The Hawk   ~  May 25, 2009 3:38 pm

[48] I'm not anti Phil Hughes! In fact my bar is set pretty low for him but he often manages to pitch worse than it anyway.

55 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 3:40 pm

@ 53

1. Why would they trade him to the Yankees?
2. Do we really want to be giving them more young talent?

As for JD, who else do you sign? Aren't they all inferior?

56 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 3:40 pm

we need to treat Kris Benson like he's, well...Kris Benson.

57 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 3:41 pm

[54] yeah, that pretty much sums up my opinion of your opinion.

58 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 3:41 pm

i had to open up my big mouth. Carp gave up a hit. he and Gallardo have only given up one each...so far.

i see Cash led off another inning with an out. i'm shocked. shocked.

59 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 3:43 pm

There's also the fact that Damon's stroke is perfect for YS 2.0 and he knows how to take a walk and swipe a base. Plus he's money for 140 games. The last time he hasn't played that many is his rookie year.

I'd prefer a one or two year deal. But I see the market giving him more than that.

And I love games like this.

60 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 3:44 pm

[58] probably for the best, i'm sure TLR didn't want to have to worry about pitch counts AND preserving a perfecto.

61 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 3:44 pm

Hi all.
Boy, this is a fun game.

62 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 3:45 pm

don't look now, but Tex is up to .275 and Alex is at .246.

hell yeah, on the 10-spot. keep the run diff moving in this direction!

me likey vewwy, vewwy much!!! : )

63 Just Fair   ~  May 25, 2009 3:46 pm

In the game of ifs, Alex and Tex in the Ranger line-up would be none too fun to face.

64 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 3:48 pm

[63] Now you know how other teams feel when the Yankees come to town.

65 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 3:51 pm

I'm looking over the discussion of outfielders.
What do you guys mean by saying that the Red Sox won't let Bay get away? I figure he'll just go to whatever team bids highest, no?

66 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 3:54 pm

This is discouraging:

Bruney said his elbow was hurting him when he came off the DL and he didn’t tell the team. “I thought I could pitch through it,” he said.

67 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 3:54 pm

[59] We all choked at the idea of JD for 4 years, 4 years ago. He has exceeded our expectations. But 3 years is VERY risky. And you have to consider losing a high draft pick. That has real value.

My guess is Jeter is our SS in 2011, so he can get 3000. ARod is a year older. Posada will be on a walker. Can we afford a 38 yr old JD?

At some time we have to rebuild. ARod, Tex and CC will all be on this team as old men. We need to get some youth every year, just to balance our long contracts.

I might go 2 years and hold my breath in 2011. I still think Holliday is a .850 OPS or better player. If the economy keeps his $$/yrs reasonable, I think you have to consider him. He will be 29 next Spring.

68 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 3:55 pm

The Green Monster skews stats, but defensively, Bay has the reputation of playing LF like Moses wandering the desert. Not sure if he'd be the best candidate to man LF in NYS.

69 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 3:56 pm

[65] The Sox could and would outbid us. They want Bay. We got Tex and spent a zillion $$ this year, while the Sox spent almost nothing. And Bay likes playing in the Dump with the Green Monster, You never know, but I'll bet the Sox get him.

70 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 3:59 pm

Phil with 14 Ks in his last 10 IP. He still has improvements to make, but he will be a solid pitcher for us. Maybe not an Ace, but I can see him being a #2.

71 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 4:00 pm

If Damon keeps this up, he almost certainly will be Type A.

He was just outside Type A last year and several of the players above him have had off years.

Here's the list as of the cutoff point:

Xavier Nady A 73.896
Milton Bradley B 73.333
Johnny Damon B 72.468

Obviously, Nady's likely to drop to B, which might actually be better for us, since the signing team wouldn't have to cough up a draft pick to sign him.

72 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:00 pm

Well, the Sox front office did approach Bay with an extension this month. He spit on it (he's looking for 3 or 4 years at about $14 M per year).
I would not pay for Damon, definitely not. I might wait and pay the extra bucks for Holliday. But I don't think the Yankees will balk at overpaying Jason Bay, esp. if they can make things difficult for Boston by doing it.

73 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:02 pm

[71] I don't believe the Yankees will offer arbitration to Damon or Nady, though. So we don't get the compensation in that case.

Well, maybe they'd offer arbitration to Damon. Hm. Interesting question.

74 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 4:03 pm

much better Pena, hit 'em short!

75 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 4:04 pm

@ 67

Agreed. And maybe because he exceeded those expectations I'm giving him more slack.

Still, the guy he is now is exactly a luxury the Yankees can afford, especially given the rest of the OF (young, cheap, no commitments after 2010). And with that status they will still need one or two OF/DH bats. Who else do you sign? Outside of Bay, Damon might top the next tier especially given his healthy history.

76 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 4:06 pm

Texas leads MLB in OPS. Phil is pitching a great game in the Texas heat, after a travel day. He should be getting some love... yes?

77 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 4:07 pm

[73] why *not* offer arb to Nady.

he made 6 million this year and his stats are going to be very, very down.

plus, it's not like the market for corner outfielders has been very strong the last year, all the recent comparables are going to be favorable to the yankees.

that's assuming he doesn't totally implode after coming back.

and, why *not* offer arb to damon. if he accepts, you're sitting pretty in that you get a very good player on a 1 year deal.

78 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:07 pm

[76] Amen!

79 rbj   ~  May 25, 2009 4:09 pm

Good game I'm missing.

80 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:09 pm

[77] Okay, sold on Damon.
The reason not to offer arb. to Nady is that we aren't going to want him on the team. If he got $5M, I bet he'd take it (think of Abreu), and I don't want that.

81 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:10 pm

[79] Very good, but esp. for A-Rod and Hughes.

82 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 4:11 pm

Yeah, I have to listen to Sterling and Waldman - so lots of time to tune out and think...

Amen, indeed.

83 Just Fair   ~  May 25, 2009 4:12 pm

The Rays Iwamura is out for the year with a torn knee. Ouch. Nice K, Phi!

84 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:16 pm

So, will Phil start the eighth inning, or not?
Yes: only 92 pitches so far, dominant, looks strong.
No: game's locked up, he has an inning ceiling, no real benefit to the team to leave him in.

I say No.

85 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 4:16 pm

Phil at 94 pitches. One more inning?

86 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 4:16 pm

Opps. 92?

87 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:17 pm

[85] Ha.
Gameday says 92 pitches. But I'd pull him, as I said.

88 rbj   ~  May 25, 2009 4:17 pm

[85] One more batter?

89 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 4:18 pm

[80] obviously, this comes down to whether he can play the OF and what he shows when he comes back.

but say he takes the 5 million and we don't have a spot for him.

somebody could use him on a 1 year deal for cheap. Throw some money in and trade him for something comparable or better than you'd likely get for a Type B compensation pick.

Abreu's a different situation. The thing to remember about last year is that the player's decision to accept or decline arbitration came before the market cratered due to the economy. Abreu was looking (and expecting) a 3 year deal somewhere around his '08 salary. NOBODY expected the market to crash the way it did, by the time the players realized what had happened there was no way for them to accept arbitration. I'd have bet money in Vegas that Abreu would have declined the Yankees arbitration just because his expectation of getting an appropriate multi-year offer was still intact.

Suppose we'll never know ...

90 Just Fair   ~  May 25, 2009 4:18 pm

Nolan says 2 more innings for Phil.

91 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 4:19 pm

Phil's *GREAT* game means the most from this game, but Alex going 5-5 is a very, very good sign.

92 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:21 pm

[89] Comparison with Abreu: that was kind of my point. It was very rational for Abreu to decline arbitration, but it might be a big mistake for Nady to do so.

93 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:21 pm

By the way, now we know what Berroa's role is on the team. Next time someone asks, we'll know the answer: his job is to pinch run for A-Rod after Alex's fifth hit of a blow-out win.

94 seamus   ~  May 25, 2009 4:23 pm

[84] I'd say one more inning.

95 seamus   ~  May 25, 2009 4:24 pm

[34] just tuning in. what was cano laughing at melky over?

96 Just Fair   ~  May 25, 2009 4:26 pm

[95] Melky hit a sure double but when but face planted rounding first. He popped up no worse for the wear, but Cano was absolutely rollin' in the dugout. It was damn funny.

97 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 4:27 pm

[92] depends on what he shows.

he comes back and smokes the ball and shows he can play the field, he'll get something more as an offer than he'll get from us.

AND he'll likely be a starter if he signs elsewhere, which he might not be here, which, of course, will obviously impact his future earnings potential.

Is it a gamble, yeah a little, but it's the type of gamble I think the Yankees could afford to take and then leverage, either in terms of team depth, or in trade.

98 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 4:28 pm

More Phil. Nice.

99 The Hawk   ~  May 25, 2009 4:28 pm

[57] That doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

100 rbj   ~  May 25, 2009 4:29 pm

I may have to reconsider my position on hating these red hats.

Show/Hide Comments 101-200
101 seamus   ~  May 25, 2009 4:29 pm

[96] oh wow that sounds awesome! i gotta check it out on mlb.tv! THANKS!

102 seamus   ~  May 25, 2009 4:30 pm

wow, so an awesome inning for Phil. Id be tempted to give him a shot at the complete game!

103 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 4:30 pm

I'd let Phil finish, unless he runs into trouble.

Pitch counts don't matter as much to me when a pitcher is cruising late.

104 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 4:30 pm

[97] We can afford it in $$, but maybe not in Team age. I like JD, and not to question his work ethic but..... this is his walk year. He is pouring it on. Once he gets a 3 year deal, will he and can he still push a body that seems on the edge of injury?

105 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:31 pm

I think this might be my favorite game of the season so far.

106 seamus   ~  May 25, 2009 4:31 pm

you know it is a blowout when folks are talking about 2010 arbitration in May.

107 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:32 pm

[103] But Phil is on an inning count this year. An inning he pitches now is an inning he can't pitch in September.

I mean, unless they're going to send him down or bullpen him or something, which is right now seeming kind of unlikely.

108 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 4:32 pm

Have we gotten 8 innings of shutout ball from anyone this year? How about 3 hits through 8?

109 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:34 pm

Little league.

110 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 4:35 pm

[103] i'm sure his innings count is the same as joba's, it's not a hard cap, but a rather a consideration.

point is mute, someone's warming in the bully.

8 is enough, it seems ...

111 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 4:35 pm

By the way, anyone see Beckett lose his game because he chased after a pop up WAY in foul territory, and get in Lowell's way? The ball dropped, and Shef hit an RBI single in the AB.

112 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:35 pm

Good point, Kenny!

(Hits for the Rangers today: 3
Hits for Cash: 3)

113 rbj   ~  May 25, 2009 4:35 pm

It is a perfect time for a not so good reliever to work on some stuff.

114 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 4:36 pm

Marginal Reward in to pitch! (hat tip to diane)

115 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 4:36 pm

aceves? really?

couldn't we just use swisher?

tomko again?



116 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:36 pm

[111] No! I saw other parts of that game, but not that play.

117 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:37 pm

[114] I don't get it. Why is he the Marginal Reward? (Diane's jokes often go over my head.)

118 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 4:38 pm


119 rbj   ~  May 25, 2009 4:38 pm

Yay, everyone gets a hit today (who batted, that is). After the game, Mr. Girardi takes them out for ice cream.

120 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 4:38 pm

Tex looks like Matsui when he tries to pull low, outside pitches.

121 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 4:40 pm

[120] thankfully, the resemblence ends when he runs the subsequent groundout out ...

122 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 4:41 pm

Girardi will never leave a kid in too long after what happened in Florida.

123 Just Fair   ~  May 25, 2009 4:41 pm

Good grab by the kid in left. Adios, shutout.

124 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 4:41 pm

Ray's Iwamura out for the season.
Sox about to win.
BJs lose again. Was that a fast nosedive or what!
The Rays have a good team but no magic this year.
Boston is our competition.

125 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:41 pm

Oh, good. So we didn't use up one of Aceves' good innings.

126 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 4:42 pm

seriously, why is Aceves pitching in this game?

he's the 2nd best pitcher in the pen, and you're using him in a 10-0 game?

127 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 4:43 pm

more yakkers, less sliders, Vulture.

128 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 4:44 pm

Well, after all the recent nail-biters, this was relaxing!

129 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 4:44 pm

[117] Warner Madrigal "anagrams" to Marginal Reward. i LOVE it!!!

feh, there goes the shutout!

130 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 4:44 pm

Does Sterling really not know that an "8 inning shutout" is NOT what Hughes pitched?

131 rbj   ~  May 25, 2009 4:44 pm

And now it's official. Woo hoo!

132 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:46 pm

[129] Wow. I thought you were talking about Aceves.
I shoulda known: dianagrammer...

133 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 4:54 pm

enjoy your holiday, everybody!

134 williamnyy23   ~  May 25, 2009 4:57 pm

[126] Can't come away from even a laugher without one head scratcher. I can't imagine the logic for using Aceves in an 11-0, especially coming off a game in which Brett Tomko was used in extra innings.

As for the 2009 off season discussion, I would love it if the Yankees could get Damon to sign a 2-year deal as a primary DH/4th outfielder. He says he really wants to stay, so maybe they can work that out.

As for Bay, coming into this season, he was a shaky defender with an OPS+ around 130. He's a pretty good player, but not the guy you break the bank for. I'm sure Bay will want 5 years, so if the Yankees can simply drive the price up for Boston, I'd be happy.

135 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 4:59 pm

[134] I would definitely not give Bay 5 years, but Boston won't either. I heard that he was asking for four years from Boston to re-up now.

136 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 5:05 pm

@ 134

They also have Wang as another long man so they don't have to use Aceves in that role. Thank the GM for that idiocy. If anything, Girardi may have been breaking in Aceves for shorter stints. Today certainly shows they won't need Wang starting for a little while.

137 williamnyy23   ~  May 25, 2009 5:06 pm

[135] I haven't read he only wants four years, but I believe he did put off an overture by the Sox sometime during March. Whether it is four or five years, Bay is going to want top of the market money and I just don't think he is worth that...even though it sure looks like he is amid this recent hot streak.

138 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 5:08 pm

@ 137

He's more worth it than Holliday is.

139 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 5:12 pm

mauer - speaking of hot streaks - just hit a 2-run pinch-hit homer off Paplebitch. unfortunately, there are 2 outs in the 9th and the Sux still lead by 1.

140 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 5:20 pm

David Robertson will be taking Bruney's place.

141 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 5:36 pm

[139] Moral defeat for Papelbon, at least.
[140] If only you just misspelled "Veras" (it doesn't start with a 'B'). No, huh?

142 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 5:46 pm

[141] Bears? Bares? Saber? i don't think i get it... : ~

143 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 5:59 pm

[143] he means, if only you had spelled 'Bruney' as 'Veras'

144 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 6:41 pm

Oh, yeah, sorry. What I actually meant was even more convoluted, but that's the gist of it.

I just realized that, assuming that [124] is right and the Rays will not really challenge for the division, the Rangers have a good chance of being playoff competition for the Yanks in September. It would be especially good to unload on them now, therefore.

145 Rich   ~  May 25, 2009 7:26 pm

Hughes's outing today was a deafeningly loud statement in support of the proposition that the Yankees, like any other team, have to be patient with their talented prospects if they have any hope of being a very good team for an extended period of time.

146 Bum Rush   ~  May 25, 2009 7:54 pm

How many times do they have to get the same statement?

147 Rich   ~  May 25, 2009 8:15 pm

[146] Until it sinks into their thick, profit-obsessed skulls. Afterall, developing prospects saves money. At some point, even a fool has to be able to understand that patience is good for business.

148 PJ   ~  May 25, 2009 8:16 pm

Sorry I missed the game thread! Holiday activities made commenting impossible.

As far as the red hats go, I believe they did navy ones in the past, red this year, and possibly white in the future. I hate red hats on the Yankees. Got a couple of great sayings where I'm from for those damn red hats or anything red.

1) I'd rather be dead than red!
2) Red on the head like the dick on a dog, ugly in the face like the ass on a hog!

Flash making "sniper" references in Texas is friggen stupid! I'm sure they'll "rip him a new one" over that! Doh!

I still contend that once they get CMW ironed out, it will be Pettitte, not Hughes going to the pen. Holding that offense to three hits and zero runs over eight strong in their house was masterful by the kid, plain and simple! If you think Pettitte can do that, well suffice to add, "I'm from Missouri!" with respect to that!

I don't know what's better, Hughes' effort, or A-Rod going 5-5! In my opinion, both are huge!

I don't think they are going to retain any of these players eligible for FA after this year (Nady, Damon, Matsui). I believe they will use that money for Bay or Holliday. I think their five outfielders will be, in no particular order, Melky, Gardner, Jackson, Holliday/Bay, and Swisher.

Have a great rest to your holiday folks!

: )

149 Rich   ~  May 25, 2009 8:24 pm

[148] Red-based axioms aside, AJ has the stuff to be great in the pen. I doubt it will happen, but I'd like to see it.

I don't think Bay will reach free agency.

150 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 8:45 pm

I don’t think Bay will reach free agency.

I think he will.
He wants a stupid deal, and the Red Sox won't make a stupid deal. They'll offer arbitration, of course; he'll decline.

151 Mr. OK Jazz TOKYO   ~  May 25, 2009 8:49 pm

Wow, what a great win to wake up to! Can't wait to watch Philbert throw stirkes on the archived game this evening.

Too bad Papelbon didn't blopw this game, but for all his skills (and his fastball is indeed amazing) he can be hit..and he is becoming more predictable. Yet again, we should all marvel at Mariano..closers come and closers go, but Mo is Buddha, eternal and unbreakable!

152 Rich   ~  May 25, 2009 9:05 pm

[150] I hope you're right, but I think they know that the Yankees will pursue him and that has sometimes caused the Sox to do crazy stuff (e.g., with Matsuzaka and Contreras).

Bruney is going to see Andrews on Wednesday:

153 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 9:08 pm

[148] where in Mo? i recently played the nowhere town of Kirksville. it's far away...

154 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 9:09 pm

[151] For the best of Hughes, watch the bottom of the second. When you see the beginning you might think I remembered wrong...

155 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 9:14 pm

[152] ugh. let's hope for the best...though i fear the worst.

cubs just tied it up. nice hitting by the top of the order...

Jazz Tokyo - i'm listening to a Dave Holland Quintet record from '02. it's such a stunning band. so unique, innovative and outstanding.

156 Mr. OK Jazz TOKYO   ~  May 25, 2009 9:23 pm

[155] thelarmissimo, love Dave Holland, got a big-band cd of his. Also one of my all-time favorties is his World Trio with Kevin Eubanks on guitar and Mino Cinelu on all sorts of percussion. Acoustic brilliance, you got to check it out.
Which quintet recording is that??

[151] Will do, that's one nice thing about the archived games, I can rewind to watch certain plays/pitches etc..further enhancing my geek status inthe eyes of my beloved better half but she's starting to come around..

157 PJ   ~  May 25, 2009 9:30 pm

[149] I don't think there is any chance for Burnett to go to the pen @ $15M plus per, Rich. He'll get his mechanical issues resolved soon. Pettitte however, is what he is... an old warhorse that needs HGH to make it through an entire season of 200+ innings and still be able to win regularly. Without it, he can't produce quality starts any more on a regular basis. His dismal last half in '08 proved that to me and the Yankees devotion to him arguably cost them their playoff spot. I certainly hope they don't make the same mistake this season.

[153] "I'm from Missouri!" is a very old saying Thelarmis, going back to the horse and buggy days. It is a reference to Missouri being the "Show Me State."

When someone says "I'm from Missouri," it means whoever is going to have to "show me"... such as Pettitte is going to have to "show me" that he can do what Hughes did to the Rangers today, before I'll believe he can, hence, "I'm from Missouri" with respect to that.

My wife and I are from Nashville, TN, and currently reside there.

: )

158 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 9:33 pm

[156] awesome nickname! it's like my own dynamic marking! : )

my guitar player was just telling me about the big band record. yeah, there's a bunch of quartet/quintet records of his i need to get of the last 10-15 years, or so. this is the band w/ Kevin's brother - Robin Eubanks on Trombone + Sax, Drums, Vibes/Marimba. he's had this band for awhile, methinks. TONS of incredible odd meter and horns soloing at the same time. it's precious!

this record is called Not For Nothin'. 2002 ECM. i was just texting w/ a trombone player buddy and it turns out he just wrote a piece in 11 for a local big band. lotsa synchronicity going on there.

i wish i could watch some of the archived game. i wanna see Melky's belly flop and Robbie in stitches in the dugout afterwards...

159 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 9:39 pm

pettitte shouldn't be in the pen. and he doesn't need HGH. he wasn't as bad as traditional stats say he was last year. i haven't looked 'em up in awhile, but i think his BABIP & FIP, showed that he had some bad luck last year and wasn't quite so bad.

as far as the "show me" state stuff = color me stoopid! doh!!! ah, i'm a drummer, whaddya gonna do?! ; ) i've heard jokes in regards to that, but i guess not the saying. i suck at idioms, idiot that i am!!!

nash-vegas, huh? i've played there, too! not too very far from Hotlanta. will you be making the trek down 75 late June to see our Yanks at The Ted?! would be cool to meet up...

160 The Hawk   ~  May 25, 2009 9:39 pm

As great a start as Hughes had, let's not get ahead of ourselves here. His ERA is still 7+, and he has displayed a real lack of consistency. After all, his first start this year was a gem and until today he hadn't even approached that performance. He needs to string together at least three or four quality starts before I believe he's over the hump. And I'll even throw in his previous start to help him out a bit.

I think he took some big steps today, especially in the second inning. He has shown a discouraging propensity for the meltdown and he avoided it and then some.

161 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 9:43 pm

[160] i hear ya. but, to clarify, his ERA is 5.16. he began the day at 7.06...

162 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 9:45 pm

[160] His ERA is still 7+...

No, it's now 5.47. Not very good, obviously, but not over 7.

163 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 9:48 pm

[162] i'm seeing 5.16, but between "i'm from missouri" and "a B, in front of Veras", we've already established i'm a dumb drummer, so who knows!!! ; )

164 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 9:50 pm

Hey, you're right, thelarmis, 5.16. I misread the table.

165 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 9:51 pm

[164] haha, wahoo, score one for the back of the band! ; )

166 RIYank   ~  May 25, 2009 9:52 pm

How about a rim shot???

167 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 9:53 pm

i'll play 2 when i go to my studio to practice in a lil' bit! : )

168 Mr. OK Jazz TOKYO   ~  May 25, 2009 9:58 pm

[166] Take my wife, please!

Anyone read Rob Neyer here? Seems to me more Sox bias.."they have no problems besides SSdefense and Big Papi"..really?? top two starters ERA above 5, Varitek likely to hit .220, J.D. Drew stinks..I like Neyer's analysis a lot but hit Sox crush (and constant Yankee-bashing) is annoying..

169 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 10:01 pm

holy shit - anyone follow the rays-tribe game? rays had a 10-0 lead and a just lost! 4 pitchers in the 9th - including Randy Choate!!!. Izzy came in walked 4 batters in a row, then gave up a game winning single, all without getting an out. Tribe scored 7 in the bottom of the 9th. whoa!

170 Mr. OK Jazz TOKYO   ~  May 25, 2009 10:06 pm

[169] Wow! Randy Choate's ERA is now infinity..

171 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 10:07 pm

shit, i just missed the fireworks. apparently, Ted Lilly just got ejected. thing is, i think i pitched yesterday, so he must've been jawing at the ump from the dugout.

172 The Hawk   ~  May 25, 2009 10:08 pm

[161] Right - I meant to check that. But I didn't! Watching Lakers vs Nugs, screwed up my research.

173 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 10:08 pm

[170] CHOATE!!! i would always say that - pejoratively - when he was in our 'pen. then, i started noticing these big "CHOATE" signs all around Metro Atlanta, for some corporate construction company. i couldn't escape him!!! who was the other Randy in the pen at that time?

174 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 10:11 pm

Randy Keisler, methinks. scrubs galore...

175 Mr. OK Jazz TOKYO   ~  May 25, 2009 10:14 pm

[173] Randy Velarde? Randy Newman? Randy Marsh? My buddy Dale's Uncle Randy, who once sent half a pound of weed to a radio station in rural texas for Merle Haggard? When Merles was interviewed on the air he thanked Randy for his "Ma's good old fashioned pound cake, it really did the job after a long drive"...

Ok, I'm done now.

176 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 10:19 pm

[175] nice work. you forgot Randy Rhoads! it was Randy Keisler though...

177 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 10:20 pm

slugfest in chicago. 9-7 Bucs in the 6th...

178 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 10:30 pm

Yikes!! TB was up 10-2 after 7. That has to be a historically brutal loss.

179 OldYanksFan   ~  May 25, 2009 10:34 pm

ARod's current line: .259 .411 .672 1.083
And the guy is still not near 100%. Wowza.

Big Papi's current line: .195 .301 .299 .599.
Is this steroid crash???

180 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 10:36 pm

[179] whatever it is, i hope each continue in their current direction! ; )

181 williamnyy23   ~  May 25, 2009 10:42 pm

Watching the Rays game, it's become very evident that what was a major strength last year has become a very serious weakness. If they don't get the bullpen together, they wont contend.

Of course, the Yankees also have a precarious bullpen, although they have more pieces in place. Still, with Bruney headed to see the dreaded Andrews, the Yankees are going to need another arm. Right now, the bullpen is where the Red Sox have the biggest edge in the division. In fact, I think aside from bullpen, you could argue that the Yankees have the better rotation, lineup and defense.

182 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 10:46 pm

holy crap, Pale Hose have scored 13 runs vs the Halos in the first 4 innings...

183 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 10:48 pm

bullpens are so volatile, i think there's time for the Sox's pen to suffer injuries, regressions, slumps, etc. at the same time, we have time to get healthy and our act together, finding the right mix. of course, all this could go either way. i just hope Joba goes at least 6 tomorrow...

184 Mr. OK Jazz TOKYO   ~  May 25, 2009 10:48 pm

[182] Something in the air over there that explains all these runs today?

185 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 11:12 pm

[160] ah yes, as we say over at RAB, "WHY ISN'T MY BURRITO DONE YET!?!!!!!!1111111????111111!!!!!!!!"

186 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 11:15 pm

[185] i had a giant burrito from Moe's tonight for dinner. i imagine you don't have those out West though...

187 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 11:20 pm

[186] i live in LA, believe me, burritos are not a problem out here ...

188 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 11:23 pm

[187] oh, i know that! Moe's is an Atlanta chain that has gained some momentum. i know there are some up in Long Island now; not sure how widespread they are, at this point. there's another similar local chain (Willy's) that lotsa folks love, but i'm all about Moe's...

189 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 11:23 pm

[183] well, after Joey Joe Joe burned the Vulture in an 11-0 game, so do I. Since I sure as hell would rather see him in the game than Veras or Tomko

190 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 11:23 pm

[188] oh, you ... with your East Coast burritos ... that's so cute!


191 thelarmis   ~  May 25, 2009 11:27 pm

Welcome ta Moe's!!!

yeah, that was plain dumb using the Vulture today. i think tomorrow could be considered a "throw day" for Tiger Wang; maybe throw him out there for an inning or dos.

i'z gotsta go practice me drumz!!!

192 cult of basebaal   ~  May 25, 2009 11:29 pm

[191] do a Banter session.

pretend you're Bum Rush and the bass drum is Cashman.

pretend you're William and the snare is Girardi.

Fill in the rest to your amusement!

193 Rich   ~  May 25, 2009 11:38 pm

[160] As great a start as Hughes had, let’s not get ahead of ourselves here. His ERA is still 7+, and he has displayed a real lack of consistency.

The development of a young pitcher is almost always characterized by inconsistency, which is why patience is so important, but at least with Hughes, unlike with, for example Burnett, there is a reasonable basis for believing that the inconsistency will cease as he gains experience. There is no reason, however, to believe that Burnett will ever be consistent.

Actually, Hughes has not been particularly inconsistent. He has given up three earned runs or less in all but one of his starts.

194 Chyll Will   ~  May 25, 2009 11:40 pm

[192] Badum-tssh! >;)

195 The Hawk   ~  May 26, 2009 12:11 am

[160] I wasn't comparing him to Burnett, I was saying let's not get ahead of ourselves off of one start. Neither was I suggesting Hughes will always be inconsistent - I'd be surprised if he was. I'm just saying I wouldn't be so quick to make him a fixture in the rotation just yet. Hopefully he'll build on it but who knows.

As far as the quality of his inconsistency goes, I mean he's had two great starts and the rest mediocre at best. Giving up three runs is no good if it's over 4 or 5 innings, especially not with this bullpen.

If the choice is between a horrific Wang and inconsistent Hughes, obviously you go with Hughes. I'm still holding out hope that Wang gets back on track, I guess.

196 SteveAmerica   ~  May 26, 2009 12:39 am

If you call yourself a Yankee fan, and aren't pulling for Hughes to succeed, and instead try to shoot holes in everything positive he does, a la Lombardi and some of the people on this board, then may I ask, why are you a fan of the Yankees.

The kid has now had two DOMINANT starts this season. One (today) against a very good offensive team. In his past two starts he has a 15:2 K/BB ratio. His fastball is sitting around 93-94 (for those who foolishly fixate on that.) He showed confidence in his stuff today. He showed toughness and coachability in the second.

Is he perfect in the sense that he'll never give up 5 ER over 4 IP again? No. Neither are most pitchers not named Halladay or Santana. Is he fully mature and fully reliable in the sense that you can expect 7 innings of no more than 2ER every time out? No.

But is he light years better than he was this time last year? Yes. Has he made progress even over his last two starts? Yes.

The Phil Hughes hatred amongst people who call themselves Yankees fans is petty, entitled, myopic, and ignorant. I just.do.not.friggin.get.it.

I get being skeptical of highly touted prospects, but to be so GD skeptical that you can't even enjoy it when the kid pitches a great game to beat a respectable offense, seems to me like you're wasting your time on this planet.

197 Rich   ~  May 26, 2009 12:39 am

[195] Because I care as much about the mid- to long-term as the short-term, there are only three starters that would be fixtures in the rotation almost no matter what: CC, Joba, and Hughes.The rest of filler.

198 Rich   ~  May 26, 2009 12:40 am

*The rest ARE filler.*

199 SteveAmerica   ~  May 26, 2009 12:43 am

189. He threw like what, 10 bp pitches?

200 Rich   ~  May 26, 2009 1:03 am

[196] His blog entries are a projective psychological test.

Show/Hide Comments 201-202
201 The Hawk   ~  May 26, 2009 8:10 am

[196] If this is directed at me you're sorely mislead. It doesn't apply at all. I was reacting to other people jumping the gun - I'm a big Hughes booster. I just don't necessarily buy into the idea that he's all of a sudden good to go, off of one start that followed four mediocre-to-poor ones.

I don't think I've read anything here by anybody that suggested "Hughes hatred", to be honest. Then again, I wasn't around last year ; )

202 cult of basebaal   ~  May 26, 2009 11:42 am

[199] the number of pitches is somewhat beside the point, it's more a question of tactical and strategic thinking.

joba pitches today. the same joba that is averaging 6 innings a start. the same joba that is almost certainly going to require the assistence of the bullpen.

so, *knowing* that your next game will almost certainly require you to use your bullpen AND possessing an 11 run lead would *you* use a) one of 2 pitchers you have shown to trust (before the 9th) or b) one of the scrubs that you would prefer to not bring in in a closer game.

And say Aceves *is* available today and pitches, is he then burned for tomorrow? You leverage your best assets in the situations where they promise to give the greatest return.

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"This ain't football. We do this every day."
--Earl Weaver